D&D 5E Can the Bard out-Ranger a Ranger?

[Yunru]

ranged ranger 17/BM 3

horder breaker, volley, swift quiver, sharpshooter, combat superiority, action surge.

Yes, fighter are better agaist single target but you can burn the boss and the minions at the same time.

melee ranger sucks.

Bah please, ranged Ranger 9/BM 11 (not in that order).
Horde Breaker, Crossbow Expert, Sharpshooter, Combat Superiority, Action Surge, and three attacks base (take that Swift Quiver!)
Sure you've not as much at-will group control (other than Horde Breaker and simply targeting a different creature with each attack), but you've more individual attacks which gives you more flexibility. Plus Action Surge does more. And you still have crowd control spells.

 

[zaratan]

Bah please, ranged Ranger 9/BM 11 (not in that order).
Horde Breaker, Crossbow Expert, Sharpshooter, Combat Superiority, Action Surge, and three attacks base (take that Swift Quiver!)
Sure you've not as much at-will group control (other than Horde Breaker and simply targeting a different creature with each attack), but you've more individual attacks which gives you more flexibility. Plus Action Surge does more. And you still have crowd control spells.

Good too, but in that case, don't see why get more than 3 lvls as ranger to get horder breaker and hunter's mark. Voley with action surge is great too, better agaist multiple enemies than 3 attacks.
But if is to going to fighter 11, warlock, sorcerer and/or rogue are better options to multiclass.

 

[Kithas]

Shield and javelin setup lets you do a whirlwind atk, plus hordebreaker and on one of the last attacks you can throw the jav for lightning arrw/hail of thorns. This is a great build for tankiness that still keeps your damage online. You have aoe, cc, and even support while touting some of the highest ac and magical resistant features
out there.

Greatswords make incredibly silly whirlwind attacks and with action surge you can do it twice in one turn. Sweeping attack on top of that and your close aoe is decimated. In a pinch you can even throw your greatsword for LA, all the damage comes from the spell so it negates the damage reduction from improvised and it doesnt really matter if you hit. Free access to extra hard hitting aoe and good defensive abilities is why melee rangers are scary, it doesnt matter how many enemies there are you still have the advantage. And in bounded accuracy the number advantage is huge.

One level of war cleric boosts your spell slots asd gives you access to divine favor! Greatly boosting your attack based aoe. You also get to use some bonus action attacks 3-5times per lr, its not many but it is nice for only 1 level. 3levels gets you crusader's mantle which is great for your party and even more slots. I could definitely see a 4f/12r/4c build do very well late game and early-mid.

One big disadvantage to neglecting your ranger levels is your spell slots. You are only ever a half-caster but if you split that hard with fighter you are going to have very few slots at your disposal.

 

[n00b f00]

What they said. I realized it messing with an archer valor bard. If you want a ranged martial caster, who has the skills and the spells to support a naturey sort of feel. Valor bards are great.

I would recommend taking 2 level of fighter for the action surge and the fighting style. Take swift quiver, and conjure animals. Shoot dudes better than anyone else for a nice window of levels, have magical wolves rip their throats out. Have the skills to find berries, and sneak past enemy patrols. Have way more magic, at the cost of a smaller hit die, chosen terrain, an extra d8 once a round.

I'd say it's fair way to make a ranger type character. Though the deep stalker with 3 levels of rogue for assassinate is no chump either.

 

[zaratan]

The problem of whirlwind is, at least in my table, preatty rare to get more than 3 enemies at 5ft of you, for 3 attacks, better be a fighter. The ranged ranger can aim in any where, is way easier to get crowds.

 

[Kithas]

The problem of whirlwind is, at least in my table, preatty rare to get more than 3 enemies at 5ft of you, for 3 attacks, better be a fighter. The ranged ranger can aim in any where, is way easier to get crowds.

If youre never at 3+ enemies near you then you should have no problem either way, fighter might be better if you are always either even on numbers or outnumbering them bounded accuracy swings in your favor. You dont need to be optimized for 2-3 targets. Optimizing for single can be useful but by far your hardest fights will be when youre outnumbered. Thats when rangers shine.

 

[zaratan]

If youre never at 3+ enemies near you then you should have no problem either way, fighter might be better if you are always either even on numbers or outnumbering them bounded accuracy swings in your favor. You dont need to be optimized for 2-3 targets. Optimizing for single can be useful but by far your hardest fights will be when youre outnumbered. Thats when rangers shine.

Strongly agree with the last part, and exactly because of that I think a ranged ranger is better than melee one.
Isn't like the melee is useless, but the ranged is better since is way easier to trigger multiple targets that way.

 

[CapnZapp]

The melee ranger should get:

Bonus action free two weapon fighting. At level 11 or thereabouts, since it is there TWF no longer keeps up. Possibly wrap it into whirlwind, and make whirlwind a truly cool power you can only use a few of each day.

A melee friendly Hunter's Mark. Having to use the bonus action you're using every single attack isn't melee friendly. Getting your Mark knocked off by taking damage is outright melee hostile.

If the Ranger gets that, it's a start.

 

[Kithas]

The melee ranger should get:

Bonus action free two weapon fighting. At level 11 or thereabouts, since it is there TWF no longer keeps up. Possibly wrap it into whirlwind, and make whirlwind a truly cool power you can only use a few of each day.

A melee friendly Hunter's Mark. Having to use the bonus action you're using every single attack isn't melee friendly. Getting your Mark knocked off by taking damage is outright melee hostile.

If the Ranger gets that, it's a start.

Melee ranger is asready good? Just don't go twf. With duelist or a great weapon ww IS a great crazy attack. Hunters mark in general isnt ranger friendly, divine favor works much better. And you should have a good con if you plan to go melee, grab resilient or warcaster and youll have no issue with concentration checks.

 

[Gladius Legis]

Rangers don't get Divine Favor, though, so why bring that up?

And no, melee concentration checks would still be a problem for the Ranger even with Resilient and Warcaster. Rangers aren't likely to boost CON that far, and unlike the Paladin, doesn't have another big boost to saving throws elsewhere to make up for it.