D&D (2024) Expectations for Patch 9?

[UngeheuerLich]

Okay we know Monk and Druid will be in it, but any classes or subclasses from Patch 7 that don't pass muster.

And yes I think we all know Bard should have been in it as well given how important the now gone Source Spell Lists were to it. It's possible Jeremy Crawford misspoke on that I hope, it's not unheard of for Jeremy to make a mistake.

I am really torn. On one hand, I would have liked another playtest, because I like new stuff. One the other hand, the 2014 bard is so well done, and the only real thing the UA tested was the new spellcasting. With all of that turned back to 2014, what is really there to playtest?

About nothing. The bard will probably mostly be the same as 2014 with a few changes that makes it look like a 2024 class. Some loopholes fixed (bye +prof/2 to initiative and spellcasting checks) and some quality of life changes (retraining magical secrets) and tasha optional abilities put in.

 

[Henadic Theologian]

I am really torn. On one hand, I would have liked another playtest, because I like new stuff. One the other hand, the 2014 bard is so well done, and the only real thing the UA tested was the new spellcasting. With all of that turned back to 2014, what is really there to playtest?

About nothing. The bard will probably mostly be the same as 2014 with a few changes that makes it look like a 2024 class. Some loopholes fixed (bye +prof/2 to initiative and spellcasting checks) and some quality of life changes (retraining magical secrets) and tasha optional abilities put in.

I don't want to go backward, Packet 6's Bard was so cool, they just needed to tone down magic secrets.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I expect that we are only seeing open hand monk because it will actually be their way of presenting a revamped chassis for the whole class - i.e. the changes to action economy and discipline points management can be projected onto the other subclasses.

I am very confident that we will see a significant increase in the monks' ability to do basic monk stuff.

I am confident the next monk version will be a hit like the latest rogue class.
The proposed changes seem reasonable. Having seen a lot of monks in play, I have to say the class is very close to be quite solid.

For moon druids...I dunno! I think they are in a real pickle because there are obvious problems with the current version, but everything they've proposed has annoyed the folks who like the current version. It can't be just nerfs, and it can't be templates. Also, memo to WotC: not one player ever made a moon druid because they want to push the moonbeam spell around. They want to turn into beasts, or beast-like creatures, and wreck face. See your own movie (the recent one. Not the 2000 one).

Also having seen quite a few druids in play, the moon variation needs a nerf at low levels and actually some kind of buff for mid levels. And way more party and DM friendly wildshape. They should just make sure, there are also buffs. Being able to use spell slots to have more wildshapes woul be my preferred solution.
The current 2014 version can also use spells to heal the wild shape form. That ability is just not used, because it is not cost efficient conpared to just turn bacl and into a beast again once the virtual hp go away. A solid buff there and using the druids own hp and some temp hp should bring the druid in line.

In my feedback, I offered fixes for both monks and moon druids, and therefore I feel that I have solved their problems for them and they should just go with my proposals, because my proposals are perfect. However, it is possible that I am slightly biased.

This... or they should just stop trying to please everyone here. As seen with the warlock, people just want buffs, not fixes, even when they are needed.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

I don't want to go backward, Packet 6's Bard was so cool, they just needed to tone down magic secrets.

I also liked packet 6. But I fear that option is gone now. Lets just hope they have solid solution. But as I said: keep the 2014 version and I am still happy (at least I get to keep song of (short) rest).

But I would not mind finding some little upgrade here and there.
(hint: a level 1 or 2 magical secret would be really cool, maybe the "songs of healing" (or how it was callled) from the older playtest packet could get some sipplings: "song of nature" and "song of arcane" which allows the bard to have a limited access to some sublists of the cleric/druid or wizard spell list.

 

[Remathilis]

And yes I think we all know Bard should have been in it as well given how important the now gone Source Spell Lists were to it. It's possible Jeremy Crawford misspoke on that I hope, it's not unheard of for Jeremy to make a mistake.

I'm pretty sure the Bard casting will end up just being 2014 with whatever changes they made universally to spells known and rituals. They may add a few new spells to the list (ala warlock) but that's nothing that needs another UA.

Beyond that any revised & new feats we haven't seen yet. And anything else they decide to add at the last minute.

I'm 90% sure feats are again locked in, barring any math fiddling.

I still hope they add Aasimar and Genasi to the PHB. Aasimar we're apart of the 3e SRD and Aasimar are a core race (DMG is still Core).

Species are 100% locked in.

 

[mamba]

Okay we know Monk and Druid will be in it, but any classes or subclasses from Patch 7 that don't pass muster.

hopefully a replacement for the Brawler

 

[UngeheuerLich]

hopefully a replacement for the Brawler

No. The brawler is fine and many people wanted a strength unarmed fighter. It just needs some conceptual upgrades. A fighting style that plays well with it. And feat support, although tavern brawler is quite strong with it.

 

[mamba]

No. The brawler is fine and many people wanted a strength unarmed fighter. It just needs some conceptual upgrades. A fighting style that plays well with it. And feat support, although tavern brawler is quite strong with it.

yes, I know that was too optimistic. Instead of abandoning this, like so much else, this time they will revise it and run out of time before getting it to a decent solution.

 

[Parmandur]

I agree with the Brawler, that seems to be taking more heat.

You don't seem as sure of the Sorcerer, what might the sticking point be their.

Just a gut feeling, know that Sorcerer has been a pain point for people especially in regards to Metamagic economy.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

yes, I know that was too optimistic. Instead of abandoning this, like so much else, this time they will revise it and run out of time before getting it to a decent solution.

There is enough time left. I am quite sure there is a lot of playtesting going on behind the curtain already. Now that a lot of things are not in flux anymore, they can focus on finetuning. What is the worst that ca happen with the brawler? It might do a bit to low damage output. But a lot of people might have fun to play a fighter that uses improvised weapons. Because it looks fun. And probably also is fun in play.

Maybe adding something like improvised shield or parry would greatly help the subclass enough. Otherwise I can see multiclassing as barbarian using a shield as offensive weapon and grappling people with the other hand.