D&D 5E Hoard of the Dragon Queen - a solid D effort.

[Haffrung]

I will in fairness say this, however: any half-decent canned adventure should include some hook suggestions for those DMs who need such to get themselves and-or their players started. But as suggestions, rather than baked in to the actual adventure.

Absolutely. The vaults of the dragon lords are said to hold the fabled Orb of the Elder Wyrm. A sphinx will grant lost knowledge to supplicants, but only if they prove themselves by bringing all six heads of the hydra who lives in the Caverns of Dread. If the lost sword of the paladin Glentar is recovered from the Crypts of Arcadia, the temple of Apollo will be restored to its former glory. The cultists who have tried to kill the party twice have a bolt-hole under the ruins of Rethnor Gak. Hooks are vital. So are plots, schemes, and factions. But as you say, everything should be discretionary, and the adventure shouldn't be written in such a way as to assume any specific actions on choices on the part of the players, besides an interest in exploring the site.

 

[fanboy2000]

The first three episodes are the only ones used with Encounters.

That is explicitly contradicted by the text of the downloadable encounter's version. First, on page two, it tells you that if you run the game for two hours a week, every week, you will likely finish the first three episodes before the end of the season. Second, after the end of episode three, on the page titled "Additional Play" it explicitly tells you to continue the adventure using the full printed product.

Most telling, to me, is that the store's Encounter's kit contain certificates for the permanent magic items in the full version. In fact, the certificates are only for the full version as there are no magic items in the first three episodes. This is explicitly stated on page 4.

 

[Jan van Leyden]

Not sure if I'm missing something here, but aren't the PC's *supposed* to be fighting against the dungeon and its inhabitants?

In these adventures: yes. In my campaigns: usually no. I see the dungeon as an element of a story in the campaign, not as a centerpiece of the story.

You could, and so could I; but if I can buy a module that's already done all the rolling for me, put it on a map, and statted out the monsters and traps why would I waste my time doing all that rolling.

I'm going to generate the backstory to suit my campaign anyway; it's far easier to do this from a blank slate (i.e. very minimal or no canned backstory) than to have to wade through and (in my mind) delete all the canned backstory first (1). The only canned backstory I care about in any module is that which specifically has to do with why and how the dungeon exists and-or why and how any bizarre things in it are intended to function (2).

And I think this is the central point in which we differ. I find it easy to take the raison d'être and the evil guy and modify it to suit my needs; in many cases I extend what I had so far with some new idea, often, e.g., using some fact of the adventure to extend my campaign's villain's modus operandi.

When I read a published adventure I commit basic plot, villain(s) and maybe other items to memory. When working on a campaign or its next adventures memory may ring a bell, reminding me on one of those scenarios. I scan it to jog my memory, decide whether it might fit. This decision is based on whether I have a good idea how to modify it for me. Jot down this basic idea, make perhaps some exentsions to my campaign material and I'm ready to go. The other way - selecting an abstract module and filling it with life for my current needs - won't work for me.

Of course, it's all a matter of taste and circumstance. I have yet to find a group which is keen to run a true sandbox style game. With such a group my way of preparing stuff would change.

Lanefan

Gah! I'm not worthy enough to have Lane-the man who always extends his name-fan do something to his name when he's quoting me? Shame on me!

 

[MerricB]

That is explicitly contradicted by the text of the downloadable encounter's version. First, on page two, it tells you that if you run the game for two hours a week, every week, you will likely finish the first three episodes before the end of the season. Second, after the end of episode three, on the page titled "Additional Play" it explicitly tells you to continue the adventure using the full printed product.

Most telling, to me, is that the store's Encounter's kit contain certificates for the permanent magic items in the full version. In fact, the certificates are only for the full version as there are no magic items in the first three episodes. This is explicitly stated on page 4.

Both of which are also true of Lost Mine of Phandelver.

There is a huge difference between "designed for" and "playable in".

D&D Encounters was originally designed as a 4E program where there would typically be one combat encounter per week. This was largely due to a single combat encounter in D&D 4E taking about an hour, so running a 60-90 minute session each week with one combat rather worked. Every group would do exactly the same encounter each week, no matter where you played.

D&D 5E is a different beast: combats no longer take anywhere that long. As a result, you can do a lot more in a session. Over the past year, Wizards also decided to relax the "every store does the same thing each week". And with Hoard, they've even got the stores starting and ending them at different times!

So, what are the constraints on designing an Encounters adventure these days? Well, no encounter can go over 2 hours in length. That's about it, really. Given that there's pretty much no encounter in all of D&D 5E that is likely to go above 2 hours in length, that's not much of a design constraint.

When you actually read the notes on adapting Hoard to Encounters, it becomes quite clear that the adventure isn't written for Encounters. The way the adaptation works is that each encounter is rated as "short" or "long" and that you should run either one long or two short encounters each session. In the first episode, the DM will likely order the potential missions so that this occurs. What happens in Episode 3, though, which is a dungeon crawl? What happens if the players go from a short encounter to a long one... oh, the DM needs to put in wandering monsters to create another short encounter before they get to the long one, which is then delayed to next session. Which is just a bit clunky.

Hoard isn't designed for Encounters. You have to fiddle with it to make it work.

 

[fanboy2000]

Hoard isn't designed for Encounters. You have to fiddle with it to make it work.

While agree with everything that you said in this post, I stand by my first response. The first three episodes of HotDQ are just as useable in encounters as the last five.

 

[Lanefan]

Gah! I'm not worthy enough to have Lane-the man who always extends his name-fan do something to his name when he's quoting me? Shame on me!

Not when it's 4 a.m. and I'm almost sleep-typing.

Lan-"sorry 'bout that"-efan

 

[machineelf]

Also the art sucks, the binding is falling apart, and the general production value is astoundingly low.

Looking forward to running the next session next week, though!

I disagree with this part, mostly. I enjoy the art style. Beautiful and bright colors. I like the thick, non-glossy paper (easier for me to highlight). The binding is a little bad on mine as well, but so far not a real problem.

But yes, the adventure sucks and has left me uninspired. I am really upset about it because I was really looking forward to the adventure and to getting some good official 5e content in my library. I don't think I want to spend my money on Part II.

 

[Tommy Brownell]

I really do wonder if we're all looking at the same adventure. In my copy, it provides multiple options to the DM if the PCs somehow manage to defeat him. One of them is that his minions drag him off to revive him. Another is that a different half-dragon shows up in the later episode. The outcome is explicitly not pre-ordained.

One important detail that changes is his living presence alters the potential success rate of the PCs' efforts to infiltrate the camp in Episode 2 if they so choose that route, as he will immediately recognize the person he fought...which also guarantees that PC, at least, can't bluff his way out of an execution order if captured in that episode.

Sure, the Cult has more than one half-dragon, but this is the only one that's laid eyes on the PCs before, and that is potentially relevant later on.

 

[Tommy Brownell]

I will in fairness say this, however: any half-decent canned adventure should include some hook suggestions for those DMs who need such to get themselves and-or their players started. But as suggestions, rather than baked in to the actual adventure.

Lanefan

This adventure starts with "you are walking to Greenest for some reason", adds "or maybe you are caravan guards", and then ends with an appendix that provides multiple, built in story hooks that give your PCs reasons to want to face the Cult, personally, regardless of what their plan is (which is what my players used, and is the sole reason the eclectic group are traveling together at all...common enemy and all that).

 

[Eric V]

Steve and Wolfgang can write no doubt I have found memories of Wolfgang's Assassin Mountain and Secrets of the Lamp to this day.

Definitely. It's that old Al-Qadim designer cred that made me but this adventure, no other marketing necessary.