How do fans of OTHER RPGs handle new editions?

[Geron Raveneye]

Heh, personally I simply ignore them. Shadowrun is still 1E with me, with a few houserules that practically make 2E unnecessary for me (and I LIKE variable damage staging ), and I didn't jump on the L5R 2E bandwagon either...which makes a port to 3E unnecessary, too. And so far, every time I found people to play those with me, they had fun.

I guess it's the fact that, for each game, I managed to find a way to get rid of what bothered me with a few houserules, so I didn't need any "fixes" that came with a new edition. In contrast to that, my switch to 3E was promted by a LOT of enthusiasm towards the new rules in the PHB, created by all the "Countdoen to 3E" articles back then in Dragon Magazine. 3E really looked easier, more flexible, and at the same time more robust, than 2E was at that time...and it is, up to a certain point. So basically, that was the only change I made because I thought the new version would be better than any houserules I came up with for 2E. And because I was given the PHB for my birthday.

 

[Scurvy_Platypus]

To an extent, they react the same.

I think actually a large part depends on the amount of money fans in general have invested in the game, and how badly the new edition trashes their old stuff. The more money and time people have invested in their stuff, the less likely they are to want to get rid of it.

The time invested part is also pretty important. Poking around on forums, I see a surprising number of people that aren't playing, not running, but still buying books. I personally find it pretty bizarre, but I grew up pretty poor so the idea of essentially collecting an rpg book (or game line) is pretty strange to me.

There's also an element of "brand loyalty". Over the years I've seen a fair number of disparaging remarks made about fans of Palladium games for example, and how quick fans were to support Palladium. But really, the stampede I see already lining up to buy 4th Ed isn't any different as far as I'm concerned.

Of course the single biggest factor I think, is simply the "group" factor. If the group as a whole adopts the new edition, then it's a moot point. For example, if you're not currently playing D&D 3.x and are playing an older version instead, most gamers look down on you. Either you're one of those bitter holdouts, you're into "nostalgia" gaming, or you're some sort of freak they just don't really understand (like those guys that do diceless or cardbased rpgs instead of rolling dice like everyone else).

Eventually, a lot of people get tired of being on the fringe of things. They'll either adopt the new system because they can't get other people to play the older one with 'em, or they'll just fade away out of the hobby. People that actively stay _in_ the hobby and continue playing an older version instead of the newer version, are pretty rare in my experience.

Poke around, and you can dig up some fantastic flamewars regarding the launch of 3rd Ed. Just listening to folks talk in the game stores or reading their flames online, you'd have thought that 3E was the worst thing in the world and had completely destroyed anything and everything about RPGS that was good. Now it's 7 years later, 4th ed is less than a year away, and you can enjoy being dog-piled if you happen to prefer C&C to d20.

Group-think is an extremely powerful thing. As long as the company releasing the new edition can manage to keep a majority (even if it's a slim on) onboard with the new edition, they don't have to worry about it. It sounds kinda stupid and obvious when put that way, but that's all it ever really boils down to...all you need is some sort of a majority, and you can ignore everyone else. They'll either leave, or fall in line with everyone else.

 

[Agamemnon]

The question is a good one. For my part, there is one game that always deserves my unbridled contempt, and that is Cyberpunk V3, the sequel to R.Talsorian Games' Cyberpunk 2020, a game I grew up with and learned to love. V3 was more than an update or a new system, it took both the gameworld and the ruleset, replacing them both by new, foreign inventions. Most 2020-era books were rendered useless by the transition, causing an immediate backlash in diehard fans such as myself. 2020 was never huge, but it was out there, with oodles of websites devoted to the game and churning out new material.

Aside from a mere generation gap, V3 had other problems, such as being released some 5 years after the first public deadline and a book that's so horribly laid out as to be an embarrasment to the few GMs who do own it. From comic-book-style line art (a style that always reminded me of Judge Dredd), V3 instead used black and white photographs of action figures....

But I digress.

Today, I'd guess the two communities for 2020 and V3 are roughly the same size, with the former perhaps being slightly larger due to the amount of books published for it (and the availability of translated versions). Both are, however, dying.

 

[DragonLancer]

Something to remember is that most (not all) RPGs that have had new editions have not had the sweeping changes to the system that D&D has had with 3.X and 4th. They tend to be be more updates rather than new editions. This means that material bought under one edition still works with the new one and that money has been wasted.

 

[Templeton580]

*

 

[The Lost Muse]

When GURPS 4e was announced, I sold my 3e stuff on eBay intending to upgrade as soon as the new books were released. It didn't work out that way; however, today I have four shiny GURPS 4e books sitting on my shelves (Characters, Campaigns, Magic, and Powers).

With Mutants and Masterminds, I was excited, but ended up choosing not to upgrade. I will likely only run one-shots and the occasional short campaign, so it's not worth it to buy a new book just for that.

With the announcement of D&D 4e, I've put a freeze on plans to buy anything D&D related, except perhaps the Eberron materials, and it looks as though I will be upgrading to 4e and joining D&DInsider. If the modules are worth $10/month.

And I must admit I'm intrigued by a $9.99 Savage Worlds core book...

 

[Umbran]

Or the screaming between 2nd edition oWoD and revised.

Not so much, in my experience.

White Wold made a habit of changing editions. Most of the oWoD games went through a paperback edition, then a revised hardcover, then another revision, and then nWoD came along. We came to accept that the editions would change, and that the players would always have to do a negotiation step to figure out what rules were in use at a given campaign.

That is one of the shortcomings with being mostly stable for 5 years - people get used to it too much.

 

[jdrakeh]

Because, after all, newer editions are always an improvement, and those who stubbornly refuse to upgrade are doing themselves a terrible disservice.

I never said this and, as somebody who still plays The One True Game (per diaglo) on occassion, I resent you putting those words in my mouth. That said, most older edition fan communities I'm familiar with (and I'm familiar with quite a few) have earned a not inaccurate reputation for spending as much (if not more) time bashing new editions as they do discussing older editions. As a fan of older editons, this deeply troubles me.

[Edit: For clarification, this deeply troubles me because previous edition fan communities being known primarily for bitter hatred does little to attract new fans to old games or said communities while simultaneously doing plenty to drive people away. It's a great way to guarantee that the fanbase for OOP games/editions continues to dwindle.]

 

[DMH]

Gamma World / Metamorphosis Alpha fans generally hated GW 5 and 6 and MA 3 and 4 but still bought them to mine for ideas.

 

[ephemeron]

There's always some folks who wholeheartedly embrace the new edition of their favorite old game, some who are so comfortable with the current version that they feel betrayed by change, and lots in between.

The really polarizing changes are ones that discourage updating an ongoing campaign to the new edition. Traveller is the poster child for this. Megatraveller plunged the stable Third Imperium into civil war; then The New Era ended the civil war with an apocalypse, advanced the timeline by 70 years, and introduced a very different rules system. ("Everybody died offstage after our last session, but now you get to learn new rules and play your PC's grandson picking through the rubble.") Cyberpunk and Battletech/Mechwarrior have undergone similar upheavals. The new World of Darkness is an explicitly new setting that borrows some themes and names from the old WoD but does different things with them. If switching to the new edition means effectitvely starting a new campaign, a lot of groups won't switch -- or will only switch after they're done with their current campaign -- and will be unhappy with the company for abandoning them.