Natural attacks increase with monk levels?

[Akhkharu]

Would natural attacks increase with monk levels?

Say a creature with 2 claw attacks with d8 dmg has monk levels. Assuming it sticks with the claw attacks, at 1st level, would the damage be 1d6 (monk) or 1d8 (claw)? (thinkin' d8) What about at 5th level when the monk gets a damage increase? Would it be d8 (both claw & monk) or d10 (next increase for monk)?

I don't have any of my books here at work (I'm working, kinda, sorta, not really, I'll eventually get around to it, someday) so I can't look it up.

Ryan

 

[Camarath]

I do not believe you can use Natural Weapons to make Unarmed Strikes.

 

[glass]

I do not believe you can use Natural Weapons to make Unarmed Strikes.

I thought you could; after all, you are striking, and you are unarmed. I could be wrong though. In anycase, damage at 5th level would be d8 (in Akhkharu's example) not d10.

If Camarath is right it would stay at d8 for ever, if I am right it would rise to d10 as he levels when monks damage goes up, but there is no way of 'stacking the two: it is either/or.

My 0.02 euro. Hope this helps.

glass.

 

[Camarath]

I thought you could; after all, you are striking, and you are unarmed. I could be wrong though. In anycase, damage at 5th level would be d8 (in Akhkharu's example) not d10.

A Natural Attack is an Unarmed Attack and an Unarmed Strike is an Unarmed Attack but a Natural Attack is not an Unarmed Strike. Unarmed Strike has it own set of weapon properties including damage, damage type, and weapon type and nothing states that one can use the properties of a natural weapon in place of the stated properties of an Unarmed Strike.

 

[Tilla the Hun (work)]

A Natural Attack is an Unarmed Attack and an Unarmed Strike is an Unarmed Attack but a Natural Attack is not an Unarmed Strike. Unarmed Strike has it own set of weapon properties including damage, damage type, and weapon type and nothing states that one can use the properties of a natural weapon in place of the stated properties of an Unarmed Strike.

Exactly.

Natural Attacks can include (but are not limited to) claw, bite, tail slap, gore, etc.

Monk Training (even in DnD's abstractions) do not include this, or they'd've listed them under the special weapons of a monk.

For that matter - a monk in humanoid form has all of those unarmed properties - he's using his feet, hands, knees, elbows, and head as it indicates under monk.

Should a piranha or shark have monk unarmed capabilities? They have natural attacks, can they use their monk unarmad abilities?

The answer should be an obvious no, and given that there is no sub-division of 'Natural Attack' between that which could be used for unarmed attack and that which is not able to be so used, you should certainly not allow what you've proposed

 

[Akhkharu]

Thanks for the quick replies.

I wasn't certain how it would work and I was banging my head against the wall trying to figure it out. Well, it was more of a file cabinet, but it shocked me everytime I did it though.

Natural attacks does not increase with monk levels. Cool. Thanks a bananna.

Ryan

 

[Lord_Fergus]

Well now...

The 3.5 Players Handbook on page 41 states:

"A monk's unarmed strike is treated both as a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons (such as the magic fang and magic weapon spells)."

I would say there is some wiggle room to interpret the question either way. You could most certainly take the Improved Natural Attack [General] feat from the 3.5 Monster Manual if allowed by your DM. This has the advantage of advancing your damage dice category for your monk.