NEW Immortals Handbook - Ascension thread

[Fieari]

As I've mentioned before, I've kinda stopped paying attention to the 3e version of the IH, since the 4e version is now of great interest to me (I'm fully on board that boat at this point). I know we keep harping on this point, but have you considered getting any extra help for getting the new version released in a timely manner? Even just someone to do layout and typesetting...

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya mate!

As I've mentioned before, I've kinda stopped paying attention to the 3e version of the IH, since the 4e version is now of great interest to me (I'm fully on board that boat at this point).

Well the 3E version will still happen, so thats a given. With 4E (much like that game) I really want to simplify a lot of stuff.

I know we keep harping on this point, but have you considered getting any extra help for getting the new version released in a timely manner? Even just someone to do layout and typesetting...

Once I get the 3E Ascension done and dusted I'll turn my attention to other things. But we may have to accept the fact that a 4E Ascension will not surface until January 1 2009 (certainly the pdf anyway) due to the new licensing agreement.

 

[Alzrius]

Once I get the 3E Ascension done and dusted I'll turn my attention to other things.

Hopefully those things will be the completion of the rest of the 3E IH! I know that may be a bit too much to hope for, but some of us really want to see Gods & Monsters, Bestiary Vol. 2, Bestiary Vol. 3, Grimoire, Chronicle, and the Immortals Indices.

...All before 4E gets here.

But we may have to accept the fact that a 4E Ascension will not surface until January 1 2009 (certainly the pdf anyway) due to the new licensing agreement.

Don't take this the wrong way, U_K, but if you can get a 4E Ascension up for sale on 01/01/09, that'll be an act of divinity in itself.

 

[WarDragon]

Hi Alzrius mate!



The simplest solution is just to base Spell Resistance on Challenge Rating, which is the official line. But that creates its own issues, based on the number of monsters involved in your encounter. For instance, 3E is setup with Party vs. 1 monster as standard. Under that scenario basing Spell Resistance on Challeneg Rating is the best solution. However, lets say we wanted to use multiple Gibborim (one per party member) then my version would be more apropos.

So there is no completely right or completely wrong answer.

With everything scaling on a base 1:1 with level in 3E the numbers get out of hand more rapidly. Whereas with 4E the base numbers scale 1:2 with level (added to which I'll be looking to drop 4E Immortal level range to 31-60...so it'll be less levels, less math and more "something intersting happens" powers rather than math based powers).

I'd solve this by creating an ability (probably Cosmic, but maybe a strong Divine) that makes all your spells act as Supernatural abilities. They still take up slots and use your normal formula for save DC, caster level, etc., but they ignore SR, don't provoke AoOs, and can only be dispelled by Epic spells.

 

[Alzrius]

U_K, I'm a bit unclear as to exactly how far the Cosmic Consciousness cosmic ability extends a being's senses. The listing for it in the higher-end divinity templates say "extend to the borders of the current dimension they inhabit" (and you seem to define "dimension" as a related group of planes, e.g. the dimension of Briah is the Inner Planes). However, the feat description says that there "is no limit to your sight or hearing," with the descriptive text for it saying "your senses extend to the edge of the universe" (and you seem to define "universe" as the entirety of a (lower) cosmology - e.g the Greyhawk universe).

Given that, if a First One was on one of the elemental planes, would he (via Cosmic Consciousness) be able to see and hear:

A) Everything on the same plane as himself.

B) Everything in that dimension (e.g. everything in the Inner Planes, but not the Outer Planes, Prime Material Plane, etc).

C) Everything in his cosmology (e.g. the Inner Planes, Outer Planes, Transitive Planes, Prime Material Plane, the Far Place, and the Death Dimension).

 

[Alzrius]

Another point of errata, U_K: Several times in Ascension it mentions the divine ability "Improved Aura," however no such ability exists. I'm assuming this is supposed to be "Greater Aura."

EDIT: Also, the listing for Divine Nullification in Table 4-16 says that it negates cosmic and divine abilities; it should only say divine abilities.

EDIT AGAIN: The section on Divine Retinue (page 22) says that the deity's retinue multiplier can be increased by 9 with the Legendary Commander epic feat, and/or increased by 64 with the Supreme Commander divine ability, which it notes is on page 129. However, no such ability is listed on that page, nor anywhere else in the book.

YET ANOTHER EDIT: Several portfolios have - for greater deities taking a double portfolio - Improved [Energy] Absorption, which says "use single source of [energy] damage to give bonus hit points." I'm unclear as to exactly what this means, since there doesn't seem to be an ability listed in the book called "Improved [Energy] Absorption." Can you elaborate on this power?

 

[Alzrius]

Quick question U_K: a First One gains the Cosmic Imperfection weakness from their portfolio, making for two artifacts (one per portfolio) that can defeat their Cosmic String ability. However, does this still apply if, for their Dimensional Mastery ability, they choose Transmortality?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hiya mate!

Been working past three nights, hence my lack of appearances.

Thanks for the continued errata I will fix it first thing in the morning.

Quick question U_K: a First One gains the Cosmic Imperfection weakness from their portfolio, making for two artifacts (one per portfolio) that can defeat their Cosmic String ability. However, does this still apply if, for their Dimensional Mastery ability, they choose Transmortality?

My take on this is that being killed with Transmortality is like putting you into a temporary coma/limbo/distant place from which you will eventually escape/recover.

In the Gary Gygax novel Dance of Demons when Tharizdun hits Entropy, the blow sends him to the most distant part of the Multiverse, but simply couldn't kill Entropy (because Entropy has the Transmoratlity ability). So you can temporarily defeat someone with Transmortality, but you cannot permanently kill them.

 

[Farealmer3]

In the Gary Gygax novel Dance of Demons when Tharizdun hits Entropy, the blow sends him to the most distant part of the Multiverse, but simply couldn't kill Entropy (because Entropy has the Transmoratlity ability). So you can temporarily defeat someone with Transmortality, but you cannot permanently kill them.

Even if your the Supreme Being?

 

[Ltheb Silverfrond]

Even if your the Supreme Being?

As far as I can tell, you will always recover, unless recovery is actually impossible. Annihilating effect or Omega effect both seem like possible ways to defeat Transmortality; As I don't think merely rejuvenating will restore their losses. Ergo, drain their HP/HD down to 0, and they would be perma-dead. (since they would regenerate with 0 HP/HD and die again)
The Supreme being, with his Omega Effect would have little trouble wiping out timelords.

However, it might be best to note if this is how these abilities intereact; like a Sidebar or something. As far as I can tell, the following things Trump Transmortality/Cosmic String:
Annihilating [Effect] (and other permanent Entropy effects)
Oblivion (Omnific Ability)
Omega [Effect]
Karmic [Effect] (Slow)
Siphoning [Effect] (Slow, but you can drain their divine status low enough so that they lose transmortality)
Akashic [Effect] (If you have this, you probably can already deal with transmortality)

Things that MIGHT trump Transmortality/Cosmic String:
Astro [Effect] (Can you regenerate from erasure from existance?) (Also, Thelemic Effect notes Cosmic String applies, but this doesn't say either way)
Digestio (Can a consumed foe rejuvenate normally or even at all?)
Transtemporal (Foes without slipstream are slain instantly)
Abrogate (Cancel out their transmortality; Risky, since you are then unable to stop them from using their nastiest power on you)