OOC - From the Outside

[TillForPie]

I know. But I read praying for guidance as more involving than just words.

Even if you interpreted the rules differently I'd appreciate you letting me know rather than assuming I would have just had him say aloud what was meant as his inner monologue.

Detecting Evil on someone who has invited you into his house and treated you with courtesy strikes me as somewhat wrong. Especially without any cause for suspicion. Doing it furtively seems even less honourable or valourous. Maybe I'm just feeling particularly irritable today.

OK, sure, its an option. It would involve a roll with the possibility of some form of divine disapproval on a fail (although you would still get an answer).

I never enjoyed the debates that D&D paladins spawned and I'm really not looking forward to getting into one here. Suffice it to say that I disagree. I'm probably not going to be interested in continuing to play a paladin if simply using the detect-evil move that is a basic part of the paladin class is something that will attract "divine disapproval."

I could provide longer arguments based on the various quest vows being exceptions that prove the rule but I'd rather avoid it, and it's not so much a disagreement about rules as it is a discomfort with the player vs DM as opposition relationship I think's been developing ever since I first described Tristan. I got the sense that you were thinking "Oh, he wants to play a paladin, we know how those ruin games," and now you're saddling me with restrictions not mentioned in the rules or in my description of Tristan's goddess in order for there to be a cost to playing such a character. I don't think there's anything wrong with how Tristan's been behaving during his time in the game, including the use of his detect evil move.

I'm sorry your day isn't going so well, I know this isn't going to do it much better. Hopefully it improves.

 

[doghead]

Even if you interpreted the rules differently I'd appreciate you letting me know rather than assuming I would have just had him say aloud what was meant as his inner monologue.

Sure. That's a fair call.

I don't have a problem with the move. I suppose what bothers me, what feels uncharitable and less than honourable, is using it when there is no cause for suspicion and using it in a furtive rather than open and upfront way. I wouldn't have a paladin I was playing do it. But I'm not playing Tristan.

So, I'll nix the open and upfront interpretation and edit the IC thread to reflect.

You're not making the day any worse. I'll take people who post up and say what they are thinking and feeling any day.

thotd

 

[TillForPie]

I don't have a problem with the move. I suppose what bothers me, what feels uncharitable and less than honourable, is using it when there is no cause for suspicion and using it in a furtive rather than open and upfront way. I wouldn't have a paladin I was playing do it. But I'm not playing Tristan.

Thank you, I appreciate it.

Just to sort of gather my thoughts on the matter for the future: Ultimately it comes down to three points. 1.) I disagree with it being uncharitable, though I understand your interpretation of the situation, 2.) Even if our perspectives aligned in such a way that we agreed it was uncharitable, there's no indication that your or my moral code = Tristan's or the Blessed Lady's, who to reiterate Tristan's backstory, has been sending him out to do all sorts of unwholesome things in her name, and 3.) Even setting aside all of that, paladins aren't held to any specific code of conduct and aren't even restricted to being Good. As a sort of sub-point to this I'll go into more detail regarding the argument I mentioned - the one of exceptions proving the rule: Some of the vows that paladins can take as part of quests restrict them from lying, using "cowardly" tricks, etc. This is an indication that if those vows are not present that a paladin is not necessarily prevented from doing those things. The fact that there isn't an explicit code of conduct like there was in pre-4th D&D is one of the things that pleased me about the class in this game and ultimately led to my choosing it (which shouldn't be taken as a statement of intent to get up to all sorts of mischief - I think how I've played him so far should be indication that that's not the case).

But looking back at the rest of this post I see I've crossing into the territory of arguing a settled issue, so I'll just end things with another thanks for making the edit. I've been enjoying being a part of the game, this misunderstanding aside.

 

[Isida Kep'Tukari]

*headdesk*

Okay, I just had about three things IRL hit the fan simultaneously. I apologize for my slow pace in posting - I shall update once the shitstorm has subsided.

 

[doghead]

*headdesk*

Okay, I just had about three things IRL hit the fan simultaneously. I apologize for my slow pace in posting - I shall update once the shitstorm has subsided.

You're good Isida. Take the time you need. Hope to see you back soon when calm has returned.

thotd

 

[doghead]

Apologies for the delay in the IC response. I needed to think some things through.

I have also started building the campaign wiki for the game, accessible through the DW - From the Outside group. Because ENWorld's Campaign Manager is not working properly, its not possible to associate the wiki to the group, so you have to access it through the Links sidebar on the left. This also means that there is some bleed over from other wikis, including Morrus' original world building work for the adventure. All of the pages for our campaign wiki begin with FTO.

I still have some work to do on the wiki, a few more places to add to the region overview. I also want to get up a summary of individuals in and around Hengistead.

thotd

 

[Isida Kep'Tukari]

doghead, I'm slowly getting things back under control here.

In regards to your post #116, re: what the average person knows about Ushane -
Ushane is a goddess of the sea, and her major temples are on the coasts. A few are based on islands, or even on ships. But as all rivers run to the sea, some of her priesthood go farther inland to wherever they are needed.
Ushane is a goddess of love, because the heart beats as the tides surge in the blood.
Ushane is a goddess worshiped by nobles, as she rules the vast estate of the sea as the nobles rule their lands. Her priests counsel nobles in love, whether they are young lovers seeking advice or contentious more established couples needing some way to smooth the sharp edges between them. Due to Ushane's connection with the sea, and hence the moon, her priests are sometimes seen as eccentric or even a bit mad. But because they are expected to be so, this sometimes allows Ushane's faithful to dance right past protocol to say the things no one else would say to get lovers to see the truth of their feelings.

Slightly less well-known is Ushane's hatred for undead. She is a goddess of a powerful concept of life, and the undead are anathema to her.

 

[doghead]

The timeline as I understand it:

Day 4: arrive at Hengistead, visit the keep, meet Lord P, dinner at the tavern.

Day 5: Get weapon and armour fixed, sleep in, potter around town, meet the locals, whatever takes your fancy (the bakery is supposed to be quite good).

Day 6: Head to the castle in the morning.

The IC post for the trip to the castle is almost done. Depending on work and the need to get some sleep, I'll get this up in a day or two. Apologies for the delay, it feels like I've been running a day late and dollar short for the last week or so.

thotd

 

[doghead]

doghead, I'm slowly getting things back under control here.

Cool.

The last week has been a bit of a struggle here as well. Hopefully by tomorrow it will have settled down and I can catch up.

In regards to your post #116, re: what the average person knows about Ushane -
Ushane is a goddess of the sea, and her major temples are on the coasts. A few are based on islands, or even on ships. But as all rivers run to the sea, some of her priesthood go farther inland to wherever they are needed.
Ushane is a goddess of love, because the heart beats as the tides surge in the blood.
Ushane is a goddess worshiped by nobles, as she rules the vast estate of the sea as the nobles rule their lands. Her priests counsel nobles in love, whether they are young lovers seeking advice or contentious more established couples needing some way to smooth the sharp edges between them. Due to Ushane's connection with the sea, and hence the moon, her priests are sometimes seen as eccentric or even a bit mad. But because they are expected to be so, this sometimes allows Ushane's faithful to dance right past protocol to say the things no one else would say to get lovers to see the truth of their feelings.

Slightly less well-known is Ushane's hatred for undead. She is a goddess of a powerful concept of life, and the undead are anathema to her.

Nice. Reading it was was struck by how Destruction could also be see as a something of an element of both. Its just a thought.

I'll get a page up in the Wiki for deities. We have two so far. They need a proper home.

I'll also hook in a link to the TSAD maps. They are a bit ... odd. The big one and the small one don't quite tie in, rivers seem to run in two directions ... But they workable as a rough and ready guide. I hope to get my own map drawn up at some point.

thotd

 

[doghead]

In an attempt to associate the campaign wiki with the campaign group, I deleted the old group and recreated an new one. It didn't work. Oh well.

If any of you have bookmarks or links to the old group, you will need to update them. I haven't seen any requests to join, but to be honest I am not sure how they appear anyway. If you had requested to join, you will need to do it again. And let me know via a note in the OOC thread and I will sort out how to approve it.

I have also added a new page mostly about the gods (I just cut and paste the information you have given me so far), as well as a few map links.

thotd