[XPH]: Your take on Energy Missile augmentation

[James McMurray]

Nah, I like Empower and Overchannel (although it requires two more feats to use). My favorite use of Overchannel + Talented is actually Astral Construct. Those things are pretty beefy, especially when you get them a level early.

 

[Kyamsil]

I wasn't talking about dealing with grunts. That can be done easier with powers with bigger areas. I was talking about an npc Psion dealing with the PC fighter-types for example. The amount of damage it can do with so high a DC can really mean that they will need healing. Couple it with a spell-hampering power, like the also really powerful Ectoplasmic Shambler that also blocks Line of Sight and forces the spellcasters to try to get out of the area because of the continuous damage, limited vision and all that. Now the party fighter-types are cut-out of the healers and spell supporters of the group, and open to repeated use of the empowered Energy Missile with your energy of choice.

 

[Scion]

Bringing up astral construct though, these are both discipline specific powers.

They are both decently strong, useful over all levels, and can both do an incredible amount of damage.

Astral construct doesnt allow much for saves


But still, this is neither here nor there.

In my experience as levels increase caster types rely less and less on direct damage dealing spells. It is almost always better to simply buff someone or push out the save or dies or simply save the slots for utility. Save dc's tend to ramp up pretty quickly, and special abilities that drown out energy damage pick up very fast.

Even then, at the levels where the damage and dc's actually start becoming truely impressive (not overpowering, just impressive) a nice little heal spell here and there completely undoes it, possibly even nearly 4 times over, for a spell effectively 4.5 levels lower!

So healing isnt really the problem.

The area of effect though is tiny, spells/powers of the same level have a much larger area of effect, and some even do more damage. So, that isnt the issue.

The only benefit this power has is its bonus to its dc, and while that bonus is nice the character had to pay for it. The easy one is by either by being a kineticist or through a feat.

Looking at it from the feat perspective though, it is effectively paying a feat to possibly gain extra dc for a single power. Pretty specialized stuff there.

Like I said though, comparing it with other spells that already exist (which seems to be what people like) are pretty much even.

So, when it comes down to looking pretty even 'as is' (well, without the ability to target attended objects) then why should it be reduced?

 

[Scion]

Nah, I like Empower and Overchannel (although it requires two more feats to use). My favorite use of Overchannel + Talented is actually Astral Construct. Those things are pretty beefy, especially when you get them a level early.

Lots of feats, very intensive, I sure hope it makes impressive results!!

 

[Scion]

Remember though, it is a targetted power. This has its own huge list of drawbacks.

Also, at higher levels taking someone from 150 hp down to 15 hp (say over 2 manifestations) just took up a very good sized chunk of the pp available to the psion, but it is only one healing spell away from being cured.

Hp are resources in a much more personal way at lower levels, at higher levels it is usually pretty easy to replenish them with minimal resource use.

Which is part of the problem why damaging spells get less useful the higher up you go, if it takes a whole lot of effects to do something, and then it is fairly easy to fix the effects, it does make it seem pretty worthless.

This power is definately strong, but it seems pretty much right in line with where it should be, even with the very strange progression.

 

[Nifft]

It seems to me that the closest powers to Energy Missile are:
- Concussion Blast
- Energy Push / Energy Stun

So, IMHO Energy Missile should scale +1d6 and +1 DC per 2 power points.

OR, it could start with one target and 3d6 energy damage, augmentable as follows:
1) +1d6 damage per power point; or
2) +1 target per 2 power points;
Special: for every 2 power points spent on augmentation, you get +1 DC.

-- N

 

[Scion]

concussion blast is a 'completely' different power in almost every way.

In addition, it isnt a power I would use in pretty much any circumstance. 2 pp for +1d6? bah.

But, it has 'no' save. That is the same as 'infinite' dc.

So, between it having force damage (much better than energy) and having 'no' save, along with having some augmentations.. it just isnt very comparable.

I can see having the extra augmentation for extra targets though. But still, I havent seen anything that really says this power is broken enough to need that sort of major change.

Perhaps someone will come up with something truely awe inspiring though!

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

It's an obvious typo, and will be errata'd. (I asked Bruce about this one.)

 

[Scion]

I suppose its inclusion as a kineticist power is a typo as well then.

 

[Kyamsil]

You have forgotten about mass damage rules and the possibility of death it entails, specially if the Unearthed Arcana rules for scaling the saving throw are used (which are IMC). The tough part of the power seems to be not the damage potential, but that damage potential that comes with a free DC boost each other power point when compared to other powers of similar level.

Compare Energy Missile with Energy Cone, also a Kineticist power a level higher.

For the level 10 psion example from my first post, both can deal 10d6 damage to several targets (forget overchanneling/talented or metapsionic feats). But while the Save DC for the cone would be DC 10+3(level)+5(Int)+2(augmentation)=20, the energy missile managed a 24 save DC.
Yes, the Energy Cone has a better area, but being a spread means that cover can modify the save DC. Also, cone doesn't let you pick targets in front of you while saving your grunt bodyguards from any damage.

At level 20 the difference is way more notable: DC 39 for the energy missile and DC 10+3(level)+10(int)+7(augmentation)=30. 9 points more of save DC for the same manifester, with a power that is one level lower?It is a 2nd level power, for god's sake!

I also think that sometimes it is better to pick your 5 targets than to just go ahead and release a cone which could get your allies into trouble if unprotected. It allows for less planning ahead. Also, its capabilities when dealing with ambush situations are just plain evil. I have noticed that most PCs when travelling through the dungeons remain packed together, except for the couple of scout/trapfinders that are a bit ahead, and that spellcasters tend to pack on the middle/back of the group. With a boosted up energy missile power you can take out the spellcasting capabilities of the party of one blow.