Grr. Return of the King makes me angry.

RangerWickett · Nov 28, 2004

I'm watching the end of Return of the King, and I'm just frustrated at the small mistakes. The trilogy was so good, up until the last hour or so. Then it was just pretty good, with lots of awkward moments that ruin the drama for me. Maybe the extended edition will help, but here's my list of irks:

The Steward of Gondor sprinting a quarter mile, while on fire, just so he can plummet from the top of Gondor. It would've been better if he'd just collapsed on the pyre.
Sam not getting to put on the ring and kick ass while invisible, just because in the first movie they decided that Sauron immediately knows just where you are when you put on the ring. It's just not as interesting to have the Orcs and Goblins killing each other off again.
One too many of Sam's "C'mon Mr. Frodo, we can make it" moments. Toward the end, instead of us seeing Frodo's burden (as we had earlier), he just seems like a wuss. If he were spasming, spitting up blood, and if Sam were just as injured and kinda emaciated, then yeah, I'd be cool with it. But as is, there's too much pep talk, not enough Hobbit action.
Wow, they actually skipped Aragorn finally taking command of Gondor. I mean, it's the Return of the King, and he never addresses the city to tell them, "Hey, I've returned."
Time problems. Why'd they leave in Theoden's line that it'll take 3 days to reach Gondor, when it actually only takes them one? A simple edit would've caught that.
Merry apparently gets flung across the battlefield after stabbing the Witch-King. How do you explain why he's lying under an Orc next to an oliphant when Pippin finds him?
Anticlimactic battle of Aragorn vs. the troll at the gates of Mordor. In the movie it's briefly played up as if it matters, but really, do we expect the King to die to a troll, even an armored one? Really, at this point, all the duels that need to be done have been done. We should've just seen Aragorn cleaving through enemies until a gaggle of Orcs leap upon him, grappling him. He should fight like a lion against a group of hyenas, slowly being worn down by the overwhelming numbers, until at just the last moment, Frodo saves the day.
And the one that most irks me. Inviso-Frodo, at the end. They'd already established the really cool visuals of the gray, windswept world that appears when you put on the ring. It was cool when the Ringwraith stabbed Frodo on Weathertop, so why didn't they use it at the end of Return of the King? Why did they have Gollum swinging around in mid-air, looking goofy, when they could've shown some actual struggle, seeming epic because we're in the invisible world again?

Honestly, I think the rest of the movie is top-notch, and I hope a few of the deleted scenes will help the mood. Particularly the mouth of Sauron, which makes the end fight with Aragorn and the army actually have emotional resonance. But the theatrical release has a few too many moments that were handled poorly.

Oh, and one last thing. From a storytelling perspective, I always wanted Gollum to fall into the lava just as he bites of the ring, as a direct result of him getting it. The little dance he does and the embellishing chorus that accompanies it was too much for me. I wanted somebody to be a hero, even if they had Gollum fall and Frodo reach for him, coming to his senses at the last moment, trying to save Smeagol.

*sigh*

Well, I just missed all of Liv Tyler, so I suppose I should go see the Shire.

Umbran · Nov 28, 2004

Each person has their own irks, of course. I'll address only the last one - the scene with inviso-Frodo is the way it is because that is how it is in the book. It's told as it is seen by Sam. One of those images from the book that the authors saw fit not to change, and I agree with them on this one.

That last struggle is epic, but not Big Magic, greywindyshadow world epic. It's the epic struggle of two very small, very worn people over a tiny little thing, seen by one other very small person. And the fate of the world hinges on it. I like it that way.

Chimera · Nov 28, 2004

I just don't understand why they didn't keep the ring and use it as a weapon against Mordor. After all, the thing is precious, isn't it?

The_lurkeR · Nov 28, 2004

I agree with alot of your points Ranger. The end of that movie was just too choppy, hopefully the Extended Edition will fix that for us.

Starman · Nov 28, 2004

Chimera said:
I just don't understand why they didn't keep the ring and use it as a weapon against Mordor. After all, the thing is precious, isn't it?

Definitely. Boromir was so right at the council.

Starman

Mystery Man · Nov 28, 2004

The Steward of Gondor sprinting a quarter mile, while on fire, just so he can plummet from the top of Gondor. It would've been better if he'd just collapsed on the pyre.

Well if I remember correctly the book describes the steward of Gondor plumetting to his death. I think there are a couple of paintings of it as well.

Oh, and one last thing. From a storytelling perspective, I always wanted Gollum to fall into the lava just as he bites of the ring, as a direct result of him getting it.

This is why Tolkien wrote the books and not you. Thanks be to God.

Alaric_Prympax · Nov 28, 2004

IIRC Denethor dies burning in his pyre holding the Palantir of Minas Tirith. That's why one only sees withering hands unless one is strong willed and thus Aragorn keeps the Palantir of Orthanc with him in Minas Tirith, I guess to his less willed servents can use it without just seeing Denethor's hands.

RangerWickett · Nov 28, 2004

Mystery Man said:
This is why Tolkien wrote the books and not you. Thanks be to God.

Well, thanks for that. Nice compliment.

So remind me what actually happens at Mount Doom in RotK the book. I always thought it was, "Ha ha, I'm invisible and evil." "Give it back! I grapple you and bite off your finger. Oops, crap, I'm falling to my death. That'll show you what greed gets you."

Instead, they fight, and both of them are consumed with the evil of the ring, and only dumb luck saves the day. That wasn't the way it was in the book, was it?

Ankh-Morpork Guard · Nov 28, 2004

RangerWickett said:
Well, thanks for that. Nice compliment.

So remind me what actually happens at Mount Doom in RotK the book. I always thought it was, "Ha ha, I'm invisible and evil." "Give it back! I grapple you and bite off your finger. Oops, crap, I'm falling to my death. That'll show you what greed gets you."

Instead, they fight, and both of them are consumed with the evil of the ring, and only dumb luck saves the day. That wasn't the way it was in the book, was it?

Yep, it was. The point was that no one could destroy the ring willingly, ONLY 'dumb luck'(or whatever you call it) could do that.

Raven Crowking · Nov 28, 2004

Umbran said:
Each person has their own irks, of course. I'll address only the last one - the scene with inviso-Frodo is the way it is because that is how it is in the book. It's told as it is seen by Sam. One of those images from the book that the authors saw fit not to change, and I agree with them on this one.

That last struggle is epic, but not Big Magic, greywindyshadow world epic. It's the epic struggle of two very small, very worn people over a tiny little thing, seen by one other very small person. And the fate of the world hinges on it. I like it that way.

Some caveats here:

1) In the book, Frodo doesn't hang off the edge. I know why Jackson did this, and that he wanted to show how much Frodo had to pay in order to win, but...meh. After the Ring is gone, Frodo is weary and wounded -- and he will never recover from those wounds -- but he is Frodo again. In many ways, this is the real victory.

2) In the book, Frodo tells Gollum once that, if Gollum betrays him, he'll have the Ring cast him into the Fire. Then, on Mount Doom, Frodo tells Gollum again that, if Gollum touches Frodo once more, he will be cast by the Ring into the Fire. And what happens? The Ring gives Frodo power according to its measure, and as it passes from one owner to another, it "plays one last trick"...as it did to Bilbo when he found it and as it did to Isildur when he was betrayed by it after cutting it from Sauron's hand.

Taking this stuff out (or changing it overmuch) damages the story, IMHO.

RC

Grr. Return of the King makes me angry.

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