the Hexer, AWESOME!...oh no I take that back

I just wasted 2 weeks + looking up new class s n prest class's for my beguiler / Charm Spinner. Apparently the rest of the group felt I skirted table rules by selecting a homebrew variant class of the Nightmare Spinner. So its back to the drawing board for me. Its a rebuild...enter foul language n curse words here.

After looking into the prest class I cant afford the fets right now. AND if I come back with a whole build based upon "convince the DM or worse the table of players, that I have a fiend in my ancestry somewhere down the line...Im gonna get eye rolls and "here he goes again crap"

That being said, I am playing in a evil campaign right now and have never really looked into the tiefling. I was going with human but now Im thinking Tiefling may fillthebill nicely...worth the LA+1 IYO? Hows that LA buy off work by 10th level?

Can't help you manage the relationship with your group. Could be that you're genuinely pushing boundaries, or that people have unfairly judged you in some way, or that there's simply a genuine misunderstanding all around.

Tiefling I would not say is worth an LA. There's a "Lesser Tiefling" in the obscure Player's Guide to Faerun that has no LA (and is probably overpowered). Same for the Lesser Fey'ri from Races of Faerun. There's a variant racial class system published on the WotC website that lets you take an LA 0 tiefling and decide whether you want to spend another level on it or not.

If you're not married to being human, the Maeluth and Wispling (Fiend Folio) are races that are a tad better and get all the benefits of dwarves and halfings (unlike the tiefling who doesn't get the human bonus feat and skill points), respectively, plus a bit more.

You could see if the UA Bloodline rules are allowed. With those, you're definitely descended from the outsider of your choice, but you're not paying a cost for a while (and you're getting ability score bonuses).

You might ask whether Vasharans (BoVD) count. Their background includes demons, though not as direct ancestors (and you're giving up flexibility on your bonus feat in exchange for nothing, so the group can see you've paid a cost of some sort rather than just saying you're demon-descended).

Can't help you manage the relationship with your group. Could be that you're genuinely pushing boundaries, or that people have unfairly judged you in some way, or that there's simply a genuine misunderstanding all around.

I was angry at the time wasted, DM said OK, so I thought I was in the clear, but players said no homebrew and the Charm Spinner is a variant of The nightmare spinner, it was tossed. This by no means was a personal attack. I have never even looked at homebrews before, I thought it was a dragon mag class or some obscure splatbook.

On [MENTION=6697674]pickin_grinnin[/MENTION]'s Dirt farmer character.

This sort of thing gets resolved if you don't allow the players to make their character's in isolation. I really believe in the "group template" sort of character generation, where every character must have real ties to at least two other characters and no character can have ties to all other PC's. As soon as you do this, you stop people from making lame duck characters. The "off the wall" character has to have ties to the other PC's, and, if the other players are willing, can join the group because of those ties.

But if the rest of the group says no, then, well, this character just isn't suited for this campaign.

Hussar said:

On [MENTION=6697674]pickin_grinnin[/MENTION]'s Dirt farmer character.

This sort of thing gets resolved if you don't allow the players to make their character's in isolation. I really believe in the "group template" sort of character generation, where every character must have real ties to at least two other characters and no character can have ties to all other PC's. As soon as you do this, you stop people from making lame duck characters. The "off the wall" character has to have ties to the other PC's, and, if the other players are willing, can join the group because of those ties.

But if the rest of the group says no, then, well, this character just isn't suited for this campaign.

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When I DM I ask that the players sit down and work together on character creation. I give them an idea of what kind of campaign I want to run. I have found that doing this makes a more cohesive party that will work together. I can't tolerate anymore the whole strangers meet in a tavern and go on a quest. I got tired of trying to fit these people who have no reason to be together. This way I don't end up with a paladin and of Herineous and cleric of Hextra in the same party.

Elf Witch said:

When I DM I ask that the players sit down and work together on character creation. I give them an idea of what kind of campaign I want to run. I have found that doing this makes a more cohesive party that will work together. I can't tolerate anymore the whole strangers meet in a tavern and go on a quest. I got tired of trying to fit these people who have no reason to be together. This way I don't end up with a paladin and of Herineous and cleric of Hextra in the same party.

Click to expand...

Yeah, pretty much this. I think I might even take things a step further and tell the players that anything in their backstory has no weight until such time as it is established in play. So, if the character is searching for his long lost twin brother, the player better be bringing this to the table - actually spending time searching for example.

If the player really wants to engage some part of his character backstory, then it's up to that player to get buy in from the group. Simply announcing he wants to go searching for his brother and then expecting the rest of the group to go along with it isn't enough. If the player can't convince the party to follow his lead, then, well, too bad. Try again later. I as the DM am not going to take sides. if the group wants to go recover the brother, then that's what we'll do. If not, then, sorry, we're not going to do that.

Dude, I just used the sorcerer class and gave it some goodies from out of the PHB II and then picked a good prestige class from out of the Complete Arcane or FR handbook.