Igniting an object

Ovinomancer · Jun 9, 2019

Maxperson said:
Wood and clothing appear on lists of flammable items.

I doubt this uncited list of flammable objects just list wood and clothing. Certain wood and certain clothing, sure, and I'll bet they'll fail the match test.

I said that damage is not abstract like hit points. You can't cast a fireball and do ice damage. You can't cast a fireball and do luck damage. You can't cast a fireball and to divine providence damage. Unless you can change the energy type, it always does fire damage. Hit points on the other hand can be whatever you need them to be.

I can't tell if you're intentionally misrepresenting my argument or if you genuinely failed to grasp it. Either way, I wasn't talking about type (although, even there, it's still abstract as Fire damage represents damage from heat, which can include such things as steam). I was talking about the value. 20 points of damage is instantly fatal to a character with 10 hitpoints and an annoyance to one with 150. Since damage value only has context with regard to hitpoints, which are abstract, damage value must also be abstract. You can't have an object value that's defined in terms of an abstract one.

If you disagree, then it should be easy to explain what 40 damage means without referencing hitpoints or making a comparison it to other damage values (because that would be defining damage in terms of damage).

Maxperson · Jun 10, 2019

Ovinomancer said:
I can't tell if you're intentionally misrepresenting my argument or if you genuinely failed to grasp it. Either way, I wasn't talking about type (although, even there, it's still abstract as Fire damage represents damage from heat, which can include such things as steam). I was talking about the value. 20 points of damage is instantly fatal to a character with 10 hitpoints and an annoyance to one with 150. Since damage value only has context with regard to hitpoints, which are abstract, damage value must also be abstract. You can't have an object value that's defined in terms of an abstract one.

The attack is just as lethal to the guy with 150 as it is to the guy with 10. The guy with 150 just has a lot of skill and luck and got the heck out of the way of enough of it that a worst, it lit some of his stuff on fire.

ranger69 · Jun 10, 2019

I have two criteria, will it be fun, will it add to much for me to do as DM?

jgsugden · Jun 10, 2019

Soooo.... how about some more examples of how DMs have actually, in the past, handled flammable / igniting objects.

Maxperson · Jun 10, 2019

jgsugden said:
Soooo.... how about some more examples of how DMs have actually, in the past, handled flammable / igniting objects.

When the appropriate type of spell hits a PC or NPC, I will determine a save DC for the items in question and roll to see which ones catch fire and are destroyed, and which are fine. If the item in question is a container, anything inside is safe if the container saves. The DC will depend on the power of the spell in question and/or the power of the being using it. An Efreeti for example will be more likely to ignite objects and the save DCs will be higher. While it may not say it in the MM, I treat the Hurl Flame ability like a single target fireball.

Ovinomancer · Jun 10, 2019

Maxperson said:
The attack is just as lethal to the guy with 150 as it is to the guy with 10. The guy with 150 just has a lot of skill and luck and got the heck out of the way of enough of it that a worst, it lit some of his stuff on fire.

<blink> So, if the 150 hp character takes 20 points of damage, it's just as lethal to them as it is to a character with 10 hitpoints? They both die, then? Or, is this a case where you're using a different definition of "lethal" than one might expect.[SIC] ``

Azzy · Jun 10, 2019

Uh oh... A hit point debate is about to happen (with the usual results).

Maxperson · Jun 10, 2019

Azzy said:
Uh oh... A hit point debate is about to happen (with the usual results).

No. I'm done. If he doesn't get it, he doesn't get i.

jgsugden · Jun 10, 2019

Maxperson said:
No. I'm done. If he doesn't get it, he doesn't get i.

Playing hard to get?

Monayuris · Jun 10, 2019

I don't really care about the 'realism' of things being flammable or how easily they will catch fire.

I rule it in game terms.

It is a trade-off situation. A fireball will destroy coinage treasure and any kind of scroll type magic item. Other magic items get a saving throw. You can take the easy route and fireball the monster with the risk of losing its treasure, or you can choose to hold off and preserve it.

Again, I don't really care if it is realistic... its supposed to be a choice in a game.

If we're talking about mundane type stuff... like a torch on a tapestry or such... I'll just roll a d6 and it goes up on a 1 or 2.