Combat Challenge & Bulettes At-Will power.

[MkaY]

Ok... This is my first post here since this forum usually answers my question in other posts, but not this time.. I think. My question is about a dilemma between one monster power and fighters combat challenge power. Here goes:

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The Fighters COMBAT CHALLENGE Power states that “In addition, whenever marked enemy that is adjacent to you shifts or makes an attack that does not include you, you can make a melee basic attack against that enemy as an immediate interrupt."Bulette (MM page 38) however has a at-will power called Bite which says that “Before it bites, the bulette can make a standing long jump (as a free action) without provoking opportunity attacks.”

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Now: If we have a situation where the Fighter and the Bulette (which is marked) are adjacent to each other and it is Bulettes turn. It chooses to use this Bite at-will power by jumping away to another enemy in a way that fighter is no longer adjacent to Bulette and the monster is attacking another player. The question is: What can fighter do in this situation. Is he allowed for a immediate interrupt as it states in its power or is he not?​

 

[Bigwilly]

I would rule yes, but that is assuming that CC is different from a normal OA. If the bulette wasn't marked the fighter wouldn't be able to OA it when it moved. However, as it is marked he still gets to make a melee basic attack due to his CC.

As the bulette is aware of the CC, it might choose to chomp on the fighter instead of moving and taking the CC attack.

Note that I don't have the rulebooks to hand so can't check if CC counts as an OA or not.

 

[MeMeMeMe]

The attack granted by combat challenge is not an OA. However, that might be irrelevant:
The fighter- indeed, anyone - can make an OA attack whenever an enemy leaves an adjacent square. So the fighter gets an OA. If that hits, the bulette stops moving due to the Fighter's Combat Superiority, and so loses the attack.

If the fighter attacks and misses, the bulette continues moving and then attacks. If it is still somehow still adjacent when it attacks, then the Combat Challenge attack kicks in and the fighter gets to make an Immediate Interrupt attack as well. If the bulette is not adjacent, the fighter can't attack it - but the bulette still sufers a -2 penalty.

So, unless the bulette is confident the fighter will miss him, it'll probably attack the fighter.
If the major bad guy in a fight has allies, it's a good idea to have one of them bull rush or otherwise move or daze the fighter before the major bad guy tries to move...

 

[Mentat55]

Combat Challenge explicitly states if the marked target "shifts or makes an attack that does not include you". The bulette does not shift -- it moves as a free action. Assuming it is now no longer adjacent, it can then make its bite attack without being subject to Combat Challenge.

The fighter can do nothing (the bulette's movement does not trigger Combat Challenge, and it explicitly does not provoke OAs, so the fighter cannot OA + Combat Superiority), unless he has some sort of immediate interrupt power that specifically addresses this situation.

 

[MkaY]

Thanks for the contribution.

Combat Challenge explicitly states if the marked target "shifts or makes an attack that does not include you". The bulette does not shift -- it moves as a free action. Assuming it is now no longer adjacent, it can then make its bite attack without being subject to Combat Challenge.

The fighter can do nothing (the bulette's movement does not trigger Combat Challenge, and it explicitly does not provoke OAs, so the fighter cannot OA + Combat Superiority), unless he has some sort of immediate interrupt power that specifically addresses this situation.

I agree with this. We had this kind of situation on our last gaming session and there was bit of discussion of this matter. But in order to keep the game going we went on and decided to solve this later. Thanks to this it is now clear and someone else agrees with me too.

 

[inati]

I think trying to figure in an OA into the situation is in error, because Combat Challenge is not an Opportunity Attack. Do not confuse the two

You have to ask yourself, could the bulette do the standing long jump sans OAs without doing the bite at the end? Since the answer is No, I would rule that the Fighter would get to use their Combat Challenge feature because the standing long jump is a part of the attack sequence as opposed to being a move sequence that is discrete from the actual attack. The fact that all of this takes place under a single standard action also supports that the jump is a part of the attack.

 

[eamon]

As the bulette is aware of the CC, it might choose to chomp on the fighter instead of moving and taking the CC attack.

The bulette isn't aware of CC - it's aware it's marked. It doesn't automatically know the fighter's class abilities. However, it's not a problem if they take it into account, especially if the monster isn't entirely stupid.

 

[Alabast]

RAW, The fighter does not get the attack.

Since the Bulette is not shifting (he is jumping as a free action) and will (likely) no longer be adjacent to the fighter when he attacks, and he does not provoke an Opportunity Attack, there is nothing the fighter can do about it.

 

[KarinsDad]

You have to ask yourself, could the bulette do the standing long jump sans OAs without doing the bite at the end? Since the answer is No, I would rule that the Fighter would get to use their Combat Challenge feature because the standing long jump is a part of the attack sequence as opposed to being a move sequence that is discrete from the actual attack. The fact that all of this takes place under a single standard action also supports that the jump is a part of the attack.

Except for the phrase "Before it bites".

It's moved before it actually attacks.

If the phrase were "as part of it's bite", your interpretation would work.

Just because the Bulette chose an attack power does not mean that it attacked with it. There are many powers in 4E that allow free actions before the actual standard action (e.g. Nimble Strike - shift one square before or after you attack).

 

[inati]

Hmm good point! Ah well