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I think you are looking at the problem with much less experience than you think you are. Software is about more than just normalized relationships between tables. That is a very small corner of the Hundred Acre Wood.

If it were something else I would agree, but all the CB does is what we do and everyone had to do in 1E. Compare tables and do some math.

Show the proper data on the tab form the right tables for the previously selected choices.

The math doesn't even play into it until the character sheet is viewed and all totals tallied.

Many programmers make things more complex than they really are.

I say again someone pull out the wingdings and make a flow chart of this program and what little it really does have to do like all other character generators.

There are ones made with Javascript and text databases rather than this that can do the same thing with less. They only lack all the DDI data and new book data, but the functions are the same. Just because you have more data, does not change the function of the program.

This is where building the database and the tables with the proper structure come into play and why it would be just that easy to add a field to the rows of all data elements to state are they RPGA or not as a flag, and then add the filter to select only those when the filter is on, and display those. When the flag for RPGA is turned off, then it goes back and pulls all the data for a given thing: feat, race, class, etc; same as if you wanted only things form the PHB to be displayed.

You don't need a Rube Goldberg program just to add complexity to the code, when something more simple will work.

K.I.S.S.
 

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I think you are looking at the problem with much less experience than you think you are. Software is about more than just normalized relationships between tables. That is a very small corner of the Hundred Acre Wood.

Besides, vBulletin (I think that's the name of the board software) is in development since probably a decade or so?
 

If it were something else I would agree, but all the CB does is what we do and everyone had to do in 1E. Compare tables and do some math.

Nope. It's "real" software. I can appreciate your wanting to reduce the problem to a scale that you can relate to from your own personal technical experience, but you're not delivering a product. WotC is.
 

Besides, vBulletin (I think that's the name of the board software) is in development since probably a decade or so?

That's a good point. The forum application as a whole represents a collaboration between separate system layers, each with (ideally) well encapsulated concerns and responsibilities. These layers are cross-cut with security, authentication, and role/group identity permissions. There's likely a php model-view-controller templating framework in there somewhere.

The illusion of simplicity is the reward of a well designed system. There are tens of thousands of lines of code hiding just out of view.
 

Nope. It's "real" software. I can appreciate your wanting to reduce the problem to a scale that you can relate to from your own personal technical experience, but you're not delivering a product. WotC is.

Boy I have worked with "real" software for 26 years, so don't need some punk kid telling me what is what!

The problem is that they, like many others, are not following one software development philosophy.

KISS - Keep it simple stupid!

They are adding levels of complexity to the software that it doesn't need and cannot get it to do the rudimentary functions it does need.

I mean how hard do you really think, or do you struggle with data management?

You know you have something that will change from being RPGA legal or not, so you set a flag for it and look for that flag when you look output results and choices.

It they have to repopulate their database to add an extra field to the rows, then that is there problem for not designing the database structure to begin with.

Sit your butt down away form the computer and write out by hand what you will need and make sure you got room for everything you need now, and the ability to add things later.

They screwed up at square one if they did not take into consideration these filters for either of the database tools CB, or Compendium.

Now you want to discuss the rest of DDI tools, then wait til they come out, but ALL a character generator is is as follows:

-Database lookup tools
-Variable/switch comparison tool
-Series of simple calculators

The other parts of the DDI suite have nothing to do with it. How the data gets in has nothing to do with making a character because it will not be done real time. Otherwise you would have to always be connected to a WotC server to use CB and could never use it offline.

Maybe you should get some knowledge about what you are talking about before you start jumping on people for not knowing what they are talking about.

When you actually say something technical, then maybe you will have some credibility in what you pop off.

All you are doing is spouting out catch phrases from things you seem to have heard about software.

Build a character generator and seem what it does.

I still haven't seen you present any flowchart yet, and I cannot find my dang stencils to draw one out so will likely have to do it digital from start and won't look that good as if by hand.

WotC is not delivering a product either. So far there is no DDI suite of tools. So far it is the same quality of software as you could call the CD that came with the 3rd edition books.

AFTER they have some form of decent software to show that works and works correctly, then I might think they know what they are doing, but otherwise they got in over their heads and planned more than they can produce just like past D&D related software save for that which was done by Evermore Entertainment.

I mean my mailman can deliver a product, do that make him a good software engineer?
 

Boy I have worked with "real" software for 26 years, so don't need some punk kid telling me what is what!

<snip>

Now you want to discuss the rest of DDI tools, then wait til they come out, but ALL a character generator is is as follows:

-Database lookup tools
-Variable/switch comparison tool
-Series of simple calculators

<snip>

WotC is not delivering a product either. So far there is no DDI suite of tools. So far it is the same quality of software as you could call the CD that came with the 3rd edition books.

AFTER they have some form of decent software to show that works and works correctly, then I might think they know what they are doing, but otherwise they got in over their heads and planned more than they can produce just like past D&D related software save for that which was done by Evermore Entertainment.

<disclaimer> I am not a software engineer, I do know several people who work as software engineers and they seem to spend a lot of time making simple programmes do what they are supposed to. They also spend a lot of time working overtime around deadline and product delivery dates. This software delivery thing is not as easy as people would believe.</disclaimer>

Back to the topic at hand.

Hmm the Character Builder demo seems to work very well, I am extremely satisfied with it. The Compendium is also very nice thank you very much, updated on a monthly basis, including interface updates suggested by customers, new search filters and whatnot. Well worth the price of admission. I am waiting for the two to be intergrated next month and, yes, I am expecting there to be several database and software issues in and around rollout date, judging by the people I know who work in software development this is par for the course.

Of course, if you think you could do better please demonstrate.

Phaezen
 


Boy I have worked with "real" software for 26 years, so don't need some punk kid telling me what is what!


Do you need someone telling you that you are banned for a month? Because that is what has just happened.

You've had a weeks ban within the last month for offensive posting, so this time it goes up a notch.

If you want to participate in ENworld in the future, you must revise your standards of discourse.
 

Boy I have worked with "real" software for 26 years, so don't need some punk kid telling me what is what!

I mean how hard do you really think, or do you struggle with data management?

Maybe you should get some knowledge about what you are talking about before you start jumping on people for not knowing what they are talking about.

When you actually say something technical, then maybe you will have some credibility in what you pop off.



Hmm. I'm thinking that it might be about time for this guy to be excused from the thread...
 


Do you need someone telling you that you are banned for a month? Because that is what has just happened.

You've had a weeks ban within the last month for offensive posting, so this time it goes up a notch.

If you want to participate in ENworld in the future, you must revise your standards of discourse.



Oh wow, I spoke too soon. That's some serious wrath...
 

Into the Woods

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