Special Conversion Thread: Angels (and possibly other heavenly creatures)

[Shade]

Updated.

Should it only have a single slam attack for a full attack (and thus, Str and 1/2 damage)?

spell resistance 34?

Organization: Solitary, pair, or host (1-4 plus x cherubim and up to x HD of lesser angels)

Advancement: x

 

[freyar]

Other suggestions sound good, but Fly-by Attack is now redundant with Spring Attack (as far as I can tell). Dire Charge might be good again.

host (1-4 plus 1 cherub and up to 20 HD of lesser angels)?
Might want to check the lesser angels vs thrones and cherubim.

Advancement: follow pattern of thrones?

 

[Shade]

Other suggestions sound good, but Fly-by Attack is now redundant with Spring Attack (as far as I can tell). Dire Charge might be good again.

Flyby Attack doesn't prevent any AoOs, so they aren't really redundant.

 

[freyar]

If you have Spring Attack, though, why would you need Flyby Attack? You can already move, attack, and move again w/o AoOs. Spring Attack doesn't say you have to use your base land speed.

 

[Shade]

Because, without Flyby Attack...

"Without this feat, the creature takes a standard action either before or after its move."

So Spring Attack is worthless while flying without the feat, unless you are already next to your opponent.

 

[freyar]

So the interpretation is that Spring Attack doesn't work for flying movement? That's fair. However, does it then let you avoid AoOs when flying? We could go with Improved Flyby Attack instead if not.

Sometimes the rules do get a bit confusing to me.

 

[Shade]

I agree it is confusing. I think it works like this...

Normally, when flying, a creature may only attack before or after it moves with its fly speed.

Spring Attack allows you to move both before and after your attacks and avoid AoOs from your target.

Flyby Attack allows a flying creature to make an attack at any point of its movement.

So, I could be wrong, but I believe you need both Flyby Attack and Spring Attack to make an attack during your flight and avoid AoOs from your target.

I could be wrong, though, as the text for Spring Attack doesn't limit it to land speed. It seems odd to me to have two feats that do essentially the same thing, though, and have one completely better than the other. Of course, Spring Attack does have more prereqs...

 

[freyar]

Yeah, I kind of thought the point of Flyby Attack was largely to avoid the prereqs. The other thing is that there's an Improved Flyby Attack which basically adds back the prereqs and turns Flyby Attack into a flying Spring Attack. So it's possible these are supposed to be entirely different feat chains. I'm willing to go however you think is reasonable, though!

Perhaps we should ask the kobold sometime.

 

[Shade]

Only if it's a flying kobold.

host (1-4 plus 1 cherub and up to 20 HD of lesser angels)?
Might want to check the lesser angels vs thrones and cherubim.

That looks reasonable.

Solars and planetars are just "solitary or pair".

Advancement: follow pattern of thrones?

Sure!

An ophan is x feet in diameter and weighs x pounds.

 

[freyar]

10 ft and 1000 lb?

Edit: final call on CR? 24? And then is it done?