Broken things errata'ed, July 2009

[Eldorian]

First, I'm terribly happy about this update. Not just because I thought battlerager vigor was terribly overpowered, and that the one in my party was easily the highest single target damage dealer, in addition to being nearly invincible.

No, what really makes me happy is the precedent of updating the game with errata not for clarification, but for balance. It shows that WotC is willing to errata for balance.

Also,

Pre-errata the intent WAS for 4 attacks, as has been stated by one of the developers here on this forum, and by Cust Serv several times.

That being said, I'm happy with the change, although I wonder if many fighters will keep the power now.

Rain of Blows, as a power which gives you 3 attacks, is still the best single target damage power a fighter can get at level 3. It's either 1 attack at 2[w] + 2 stat mods and other mods, or 3 attacks each at [W] + other mods, which once you get weapon focus and a +2 weapon is quite good. I believe that fighters who use flails, light blades, or spears will still keep the power.

FWIW, the problem now with BRV is...you'll not often get to use the +1(or +2) damage to your attacks.

Before, you could rely on getting THP from getting hit before your turn. Your AC was low (chain), and you are the defender, so you are *bound* to get hit during that first round of combat, often before you get to go. After you were hit, you got THPs, and thus when you attacked, got a +1(or +2, with hammers) damage. That was the whole point of going with chain and not tanking up to plate.

Now, you first need to hit to get the THPs.....and by the time your turn comes around again, it's likely (see above) that you'll have been hit, and your THPs are gone. Thus no +1(or +2) damage.

Add to that the fact that you must *hit* to get THPs, thus using a low proficiency weapon (re: hammer) is stupid.

So before, hammer and chain was the way to go. Now? Plate and longsword. Forget the damage bonus: you'll rarely get it.

(sigh)

AWESOME! Another added benefit that I had not realized! Battlerager vigor, in addition to no longer making you invincible, also no longer makes you out damage other fighters most of the time! Seriously guys, the fighter in my party had double crag hammers, hammer rhythm, and battlerager vigor. It was crazy damage, more than any of the strikers could do single target (we don't have a ranger).

 

[keterys]

I don't think you'll have much luck proving that you gain temp hp before resolving the attack, including the hit and damage part.

 

[Nail]

I don't think you'll have much luck proving that you gain temp hp before resolving the attack, including the hit and damage part.

That's my thought too.

However: It is true that the order of "Making an Attack" has damage coming after hitting )), and that the BRV power now says "Whenever you hit an enemy with a melee or a close attack, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier, plus any temporary hit points normally granted by the power."

It's all in how you parse that.

 

[MyISPHatesENWorld]

That's my thought too.

However: It is true that the order of "Making an Attack" has damage coming after hitting )), and that the BRV power now says "Whenever you hit an enemy with a melee or a close attack, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier, plus any temporary hit points normally granted by the power."

It's all in how you parse that.

Yep. Add to that that they didn't use the language that previously explicitly stated that temp HPs were gained after an attack (in this case which hit the battlerager) was resolved:

"Each time an enemy hits you with a melee or a close attack, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier (after the attack is resolved)." - Battlerager Vigor, pre-errata, PHBII, page 6

 

[Eldorian]

The errata to dual strike inspired me to make a fighter I've been wanting to make for a while: a tempest fighter with a scourge and a whip! She punishes naughty monsters! (level 12 cause that's what level my party is)

The new dual strike makes having a reach offhand weapon beneficial, which it wasn't before. Though this character was made for concept, it's nice when it's effective too.

====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&DI Character Builder ======
Clarissa, level 12
Half-Orc, Fighter, Shock Trooper
Fighter Talents: Tempest Technique
Birth - Among Another Race: Among Another Race (Drow)

FINAL ABILITY SCORES
Str 21, Con 13, Dex 21, Int 9, Wis 13, Cha 11.

STARTING ABILITY SCORES
Str 16, Con 12, Dex 16, Int 8, Wis 12, Cha 10.


AC: 28 Fort: 27 Reflex: 25 Will: 20
HP: 104 Surges: 11 Surge Value: 26

TRAINED SKILLS
Intimidate +13, Athletics +15, Stealth +15

UNTRAINED SKILLS
Acrobatics +10, Arcana +5, Bluff +6, Diplomacy +6, Dungeoneering +7, Endurance +8, Heal +7, History +5, Insight +7, Nature +7, Perception +7, Religion +5, Streetwise +6, Thievery +10

FEATS
Level 1: Whip Training
Level 2: Weapon Focus (Flail)
Level 4: Thirst for Battle
Level 6: Toughness
Level 8: Two-Weapon Fighting
Level 10: Whip Expert
Level 11: Danger Sense
Level 12: Agile Tempest

POWERS
Fighter at-will 1: Footwork Lure
Fighter at-will 1: Dual Strike
Fighter daily 1: Tempest Dance
Fighter daily 5: Rain of Steel
Fighter daily 9: Jackal Strike
Fighter encounter 1: Funneling Flurry
Fighter encounter 3: Rain of Blows
Fighter encounter 7: Not So Fast
Fighter utility 10: Strength From Pain
Fighter utility 2: Pass Forward
Fighter utility 6: Battle Awareness

ITEMS
Feral Earthhide Armor +3, Bloodthirsty Scourge +3, Farslayer Whip +3, Periapt of Recovery +3, Iron Armbands of Power (heroic tier)
====== Created Using Wizards of the Coast D&DI Character Builder ======

 

[Obryn]

Honestly, a BRV Fighter should just get themselves Brash Strike and never worry about damage again.

-O

 

[keterys]

That's my thought too.

However: It is true that the order of "Making an Attack" has damage coming after hitting )), and that the BRV power now says "Whenever you hit an enemy with a melee or a close attack, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier, plus any temporary hit points normally granted by the power."

It's all in how you parse that.

Perhaps - but I'm pretty sure you _also_ deal damage 'when you hit', so you can try and figure out some order of operations there potentially... but it's _very_ clear what the intent is, because it says you gain the bonus to damage when you have temp hp, which you _always_ have when you hit, ergo they either should have said 'you get +1/+2 to damage' without the caveat, or intended to require the temp hp first.

So, given lack of rules support to definitely have the damage bonus apply, and implied rules support that it doesn't...

 

[FireLance]

With the new errata, I'm tempted to make the following feat available to Battlerager Vigor fighters to retain the flavor of the guy who gets stronger when hurt:

Wounded Vigor
Prerequisites: Fighter, Battlerager Vigor class feature
Benefit: At the start of your turn, if you have taken hit point damage from an enemy since the end of your last turn, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier.​

This feat also makes it easier for a Battlerager Vigor fighter to gain the damage bonus when in light armor or chainmail.

 

[Regicide]

So, now that fighter has been nerfed, do we wait 8 more months for wizard daily/utility nerfs?

 

[Garthanos]

With the new errata, I'm tempted to make the following feat available to Battlerager Vigor fighters to retain the flavor of the guy who gets stronger when hurt:

Wounded Vigor
Prerequisites: Fighter, Battlerager Vigor class feature
Benefit: At the start of your turn, if you have taken hit point damage from an enemy since the end of your last turn, you gain temporary hit points equal to your Constitution modifier.​

This feat also makes it easier for a Battlerager Vigor fighter to gain the damage bonus when in light armor or chainmail.

Kewl I have snagged that!!