D&D 3E/3.5 3.5E Holy Weapon Break DC? Effects?

[Bathnor]

Hello all, have a couple questions.

One of my players is thinking that the current encounter they are in (game was stoped mid battle due to time) is going very badly. Don't want to give away any spoilers, but they were fighting some demons who were trying to break through a dome of force. The demons were successful and freed the demon "general" that was traped underneath. The original wave of demons is dead, a wave of demon reinforcements are coming in from two directions. The party does have some celestials that are helping them.

Anyways, the player in question is surrounded by a Vrock, a Babu, and the general. He also is close to others, including a Retreiver and a Hezru. He is low on spells and his alignment is currrently NG. He has a +2 holy greatsword. He wants to break it and see if it has any ill effects on the surrouding demons. He does not care if he dies in the process (he's already pretty hurt , and the "general" doesn't care for clerics.

So does anyone know the break DC for a weapon like this? He has a high STR at the momemt due to some buffs.

Second, what kind of effects should this thing do? Should it fizzle? Sould it just effect him? Everyone in range, both friend and foe? Just the Demons? I had an old Lankhmar adventure that had a nice trap. It was a huge field with 2 big rocks piled on each other in the middle. We'll the party was looking for someone, so they climed up on the rocks for a better view. There was a wand of fireballs wedged between the two rocks and when it broke from the extra weight, all 50 charges went off at whoever was in range. Thats a lot of fire. Anyways thanks in advance. (If it matters, the campaign is set in FR)

 

[Dandu]

You ruin a weapon.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

Sounds like a fun encounter!

Honestly, if he wants to break the sword, I'd just let him with no roll because it's an intentional act. The precedent for this is the Staff of the Magi retributive strike; a wiz can just break it, no roll necessary. With a quick prayer to his god, and his willingness to sacrifice himself, I think that's enough to just do it, if only because it's a cool thing for the character to do.

If you really want to use a break DC, well, note that sundering it would be fairly difficult. If I calc'd correctly (assuming a +4 effective bonus), it has hardness 18 and 50 hp. Compare that to an iron door, hardness 10, 60 hp, which has break DC28. So it's kind of like an iron door with "harden" (level 6, CL16, reqs Int 16(+3) to cast) cast on it... so maybe DC31? Seems awfully steep for someone intentionally trying to break his own weapon-- and terribly anticlimactic if he fails!

As for a power release, I don't think there's any RAW reason that should happen, so it's up to the GM. I'd say yes, go ahead, because it's an interesting idea. The sword is based on "holy smite" spell, and assuming the sword was creafted by a default CL7th level caster, then I'd just say the sword explodes just like the spell centered on the cleric, maybe with the extra +2 tacked on, thus doing 7d6+2 damage to each evil outsider (and blinding them for a round, though the cleric and his good aligned buddies are unscathed) in a 20ft radius. If GM is generous, maximize the damage, or assume a higher CL for good measure.

Ultimately, though, this is all GM ruling, I believe. That's my 2cp, anyway. Good luck with it

 

[Vegepygmy]

By the book, Dandu has it right.

I don't think it would be out of line to let this work, though, because it seems kinda cool. Do be aware, however, that you will be setting a precedent, and magic items can be Sundered when their owners don't want them to be.

The prerequisite spell for the holy special ability is holy smite. If I were going to allow the player's idea to work, I'd rule that the "contained spell" is released from the sword: so you'd get a 20-ft.-radius burst that deals 7d6 damage to evil outsiders and blinds them for 1 round (DC 16 Will save for half damage and no blindness).

The DC to bend an iron bar is 24, but snapping a sword blade should be significantly easier than that. I'd probably set the DC at 15 for a normal blade, and add 1 for each point of enhancement bonus. So....17?

 

[Vegepygmy]

If you really want to use a break DC, well, note that sundering it would be fairly difficult. If I calc'd correctly (assuming a +4 effective bonus), it has hardness 18 and 50 hp.

Only enhancement bonuses add to hardness and hp; the holy special ability is irrelevant. So it would be hardness 14 and 30 hp.

Compare that to an iron door, hardness 10, 60 hp, which has break DC28.

Because it's 2 inches thick. The flat of a sword blade is much thinner, and thus easier to break.

The sword is based on "holy smite" spell, and assuming the sword was creafted by a default CL7th level caster, then I'd just say the sword explodes just like the spell centered on the cleric...

Great minds think alike.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

Only enhancement bonuses add to hardness and hp; the holy special ability is irrelevant. So it would be hardness 14 and 30 hp.

Ah, seems you're right. Thanks for the correction!

Because it's 2 inches thick. The flat of a sword blade is much thinner, and thus easier to break.

Yes, my DC31 seemed way too high; baselining against an iron bar makes a LOT more sense. I'll second your DC17 strength check to break.

 

[Nifft]

Breaking a Holy weapon inflicts the following condition on all demons within line of sight: [sblock]Laughing.[/sblock]

Cheers, -- N

 

[shadyizok]

Hmm, it's a cool idea. As others have said allready by raw it does nothing but you could make a GM ruling. Since there are celestials fighting with the PC's let's assume the players god is watching and perhaps he would be inclined to make a little intervention in the form of a cool effect (and therefore a one time event and not a precedent).

Idea's for effects:

the holy smite effect as detailed by previous posters
summoning more celestials to counter the demon reinforcements
healing the pcs/celestials
an antimagic field that only affects evil outsiders
Reality Maelstrom effect
the pc dies and a powerfull celestial spawns out of the players ashes

 

[udalrich]

Shady has several good ideas. Based on the comment that the player does not care if he dies, I had though of something like the following.

14d6 damage to all creatures (including the PC) in a 20 foot radius burst and blindness for 2 rounds to evil outsiders. Will save DC 16 for half damage and 1 round of blindness for all but the breaker.

This is basically a double damage version, which has it's full effect on the PC who triggers it.

You could also use the PC's level for the caster level (sort of like a staff) and maybe even his best attribute for the save DC if you think the party is truly in danger and needs even more help.

 

[Theo R Cwithin]

Another more 'mythic' idea, with exactly zero grounding in RAW:

If the PC is intent on martyring himself, maybe breaking the sword imbues him with some celestial spirit (insta-heal; or gain half-celestial template; or transform into some [good] outsider; etc).

Now he can finish out the battle in a dramatic way, maybe even win. But when it's all over, regardless of outcome, he is definitely, undeniably and without a doubt D.E.A.D. as the celestial spirit leaves his body and escorts his soul to the Happily Ever After.

Another 2 coppers.