I spend way too much on RPG's.

[delericho]

My purchases have dropped off sharply in the last few years. Almost the only thing I get nowadays in my ongoing Pathfinder Adventure Path subscription.

Part of that is purely that I didn't adopt either D&D 4e or Pathfinder, and that saved me buying lots of supplements for a game I wasn't going to play.

Part of it was the realisation that I had enough material that I could never buy anything again and still wouldn't run out - and that even if I only ever ran published adventures in published settings, and didn't repeat myself.

Part of it was a simple change in tastes - I'm now of the opinion that most RPGs are far too complex and ornate even in the Core Rulebooks alone. When virtually all RPGs are now supported with extensive lines of thick hardback supplements, that just looks to me like horrendous bloat - in order to justify all those pages they have to fill them with stuff, and that stuff clogs up the system.

Part of it is that companies produce the wrong things. Almost all RPGs would benefit from having more published adventure support, but virtually none of them receive adequate support. And many games would benefit from "useful but dull" items like power/monster/equipment cards, but there seems to be little market for them so they don't get produced. (And, in the case of "Black Crusade", which is the latest game I tried but rejected, it was screaming out for both an expanded setting book and some sort of "Monster Manual". As yet, there is no sign of either.)

And part of it is purely price. Now I do get that this is somewhat unfair - RPGs have at worst kept pace with inflation, or may even have dropped in price relative to inflation. The problem is, though, that my income has not kept pace with inflation, and with getting married this year (and my wife not currently working), my expenses have risen significantly. So the cost of RPGs as a percentage of my disposable income has risen sharply. The bottom line is that I simply can't justify spending £27 for a published adventure for "Black Crusade".

Now that last isn't directly an issue for publishers - they need to produce their products at the price point to maximise their profits. That's not only the way it is, it is the way it should be. I would much rather see products being produced even if I can't afford them, than see them fold by trying the cater to me. But it does remain the case that I've been priced out of the market.

 

[mmadsen]

I can be much smarter with the money I have spent on all of this stuff. I could put all that money into quickly building up that 6 month nest egg we are all supposed to have, rather than build it at the barely anemic pace we have been. I could pay off all my credit card debt considerably faster, even though I have done a decent job at that, I have paid off several thousand in just the last 4 months. Still, I would like to go faster.

Plus we have wanted to go on a long family vacation to Europe for many years now. If I focused on putting money away that I spend on the gaming, we could go on that trip in a couple of years, even faster once I get all the credit cards paid off, which should be in about another 4 months.

So it is just really hitting me how much I could do in terms of far more responsible and important ways if I stopped buying RPG materials I seriously and simply do not need, at all.

If you're in debt, you definitely don't need any more RPG material. You know what to do, and I think you can do it.

I'd even consider selling off the stuff you now realize you won't use any time soon.

 

[Treebore]

If you're in debt, you definitely don't need any more RPG material. You know what to do, and I think you can do it.

I'd even consider selling off the stuff you now realize you won't use any time soon.

I am in debt. What married person with 3 kids, 2 in college, isn't? Yet, it isn't like I am in nay kind of desperate situation. I can afford all my bills and have some money left over. Its just I have become really sick of being in debt, and have been working out a debt pay off plan where in 10 to 15 years I would be debt free, even of our mortgages. After that, I would have to pay is utilities and taxes, with property taxes being my biggest.

To do that the most effectively, and therefore the fastest, you have to force yourself to realize what you need to have versus what you don't need to have. Hence my thoughts on RPG purchasing.

Another thing I have realized is that my family cannot go the next 10 to 15 years living in an austere manner. We have to have some fun over those years. So right now I can manage $500 a month in pay downs without us being unable to do some fun things. I've just done the numbers and realized if I cut out gaming expenses, the books, materials, as well as conventions, I can up that to $700/month, and I also like how much faster that helps everything happen over the long haul. Plus we are able to refinance our home, despite being seriously upside down on it, thanks to an Obama program, which will give me another $300 per month to work with. Which will allow me to do $1,000/month. I really like the time schedule if I can hit $1,000/month. It would take us to under 10 years.

But for long term pay off plans to work, you have to do the "nest egg" thing, because if you don't every unexpected problem that comes along drives you back into debt. Even at $1,000/month the minimum suggested nest egg will take me a year to build, and the most ideal would take 3 years to build.

I am really, really, tired of debt, and believe I am tired enough of it to remain committed to getting out of it once and for all. As close as anyone can get anyways, with taxes always hitting you, even after you die.

So I am willing, and most importantly, believe I am able, to give up the habit of buying RPG stuff I do not need, as well as give up going to conventions. As it is I play a minimum of three games per week, and on really good weeks as many as 5 times, so it isn't like I need to go to conventions.

So yeah, I am going to commit myself to do this. If I am lucky enough I/we will be debt free in as little as 10 years, hopefully no more than 15, since I cannot see what the future holds.

 

[Emirikol]

I know the feeling. Ive got kids - kids that I want to continue to roleplay with. Currently we play some pathfinder..occasionally..but there are so many other options.

I spent money on Mouseguard, thinking I'd play it. I don't.
I spent time converting Star Frontiers so we could play it. They didn't want to play it.

I've now done the characters for indiana jones..and it's a lukewarm reception at best for interest.

If they're only interested in playing the occasional 2-hour, monthly game of pathfinder, I look at my shelves crammed full of rpgs from the past 32 years..that are completely dead to me. They serve zero purpose at this point. Most of them i don't even have memories with..they were just something I bought..and am still paying off student loans

Now that the production of WFRP3 has ground down to a virtual halt, I'm actually ecstatic that I don't feel anything about it. My regular group could care less. They only had to buy the players guide anyways (and some didn't even do that because they're cheapasses and leech off of me, the GM).


I'm to the point where "PRODUCT" doesn't do it for me anymore. EXPERIENCES do. I think I've been coming to this realization for a few years as I started griping about why I didn't care for splatbooks anymore and would prefer more scenarios and adventure paths instead (which are unfortunately less profitable for a game company..but what we ACTUALLY remember after 30 years and what we ACTUALLY get enjoyment with our kids).

Playtime is now a precious commodity now that I'm a family man, and when I think about my parents asking me about why I spent so much time in the 80's obsessing over this stupid game (blame Satan), I realize how much of my time then could have been better spent doing more diverse things with my life.

I do not want the life of an obsessed RPG'er for my children. I do not want to go to their apartment when they move out and see stacks and stacks of RPGs from their hard earned, low-paying wages. The same goes for collectable card games or any other pleasurable pursuit that shouldn't be performed at the expense of all other life experiences.

That part of my life was too short..and I wasted my limited resources and endless time on it. Now that I'm 40, I have endless resources and very, very little time..and only memories of dry, stinky boxes filled with cardboard cutouts and the poor quality stuff of the 80's and 90's. Oh, if we would have only had adventure Path's back then...

Enjoy your convention experiences with your family. They are worth more than $1000 in books in pure life experience, getting out of the house, and spending time with the people that will be the last things you'll see on this earth.

jh

.

 

[mmadsen]

I am in debt. What married person with 3 kids, 2 in college, isn't?

You can be married with kids and not carry credit-card debt. (We're not talking about mortgages or car payments here.)

Its just I have become really sick of being in debt, and have been working out a debt pay off plan where in 10 to 15 years I would be debt free, even of our mortgages.

You have credit-card debt, and you expect to pay off your mortgage in 10 years?

Another thing I have realized is that my family cannot go the next 10 to 15 years living in an austere manner.

I suspect that austere means different things to different folks.

Anyway, i think we all make purchases that don't bring us much happiness per dollar, and sometimes we make big purchases that nonetheless pay for themselves (in happiness).

Collecting things seems to be a habit more than a rewarding hobby for many people.

Plus we are able to refinance our home, despite being seriously upside down on it...

If you're getting a lower interest rate, while paying few fees, great. If you're simply reducing your monthly payment, not great.

As it is I play a minimum of three games per week, and on really good weeks as many as 5 times, so it isn't like I need to go to conventions.

If you look forward to it all year, a convention may be totally justified. It may be more fun per dollar than other, less-expensive purchases.

Anyway, as I said earlier, I think you can do this.

 

[Li Shenron]

To do that the most effectively, and therefore the fastest, you have to force yourself to realize what you need to have versus what you don't need to have. Hence my thoughts on RPG purchasing.

This is what I've always done, and the result has been that I've actually spent very little overall (think like ~25 books in 10 years, mostly concentrated in a 5 year period). Maybe 9 times out of 10 that I questioned if I really needed something I was about to buy, the result was NO. For me it was usually enough to think "wait another month" or better, "wait until next discount round" to have my interest in a certain book wane below the threshold.

But at the same time it might be too harsh to reason this way. After all, it's your hobby, and you don't really NEED any of this, you buy stuff because it makes you happy. It makes you happy not just to play but also to read, to own, or even simply just the act of buying it (shopping makes a lot of people happy, at least at the moment).

Before you try going cold turkey... why don't you just set yourself a monthly budget?

It's the same concept as when quitting to smoke: a lot of people just can't go cold turkey without getting depressed and then failing again into the same bad habit. Setting a budget e.g. 10 smokes a day (assuming someone smoking normally more, but not a lot more) is easier.

So you can try e.g. to set a budget of 100$ or 50$ a month. If next purchase would put you above your budget, you don't buy it now, but you have to wait until the 1st day of next month, when your budget refreshes.

If you have a purchase in mind that alone is more than your budget, you have to "save up" a month of budget (or part of it) by not using it, in order to buy that bigger purchase the next month.

Try this way first, and if you can manage then you can probably easily lower the budget even further later, or you'll find out that you won't need even that because you don't use all your budget at all.

 

[Treebore]

I've done the monthly budget thing, its how I save up for conventions, etc... Then unexpected things like the Reaper Kickstarter come along, and budgets are ignored.

Besides, like I said, I have a pretty big collection of RPG's as it is. Especially for the RPG's I like. For D&D I own the majority of what has been put out for it from the Little Brown Books all the way up thorugh 3E, including much of what was put out by 3PP's. So I literally have HUNDREDS of D&D books and adventure modules. Then I bought a lot of Pathfinder. Combine rules books, setting supplements, adventures and the AP's I easily have over 100 Pathfinder products. Then there is my Dungeon and Dragon magazine collections, over 100 of each.

As I think I mentioned earlier, I not only own most of Mongoose Traveller (All but 3 or 4 books) I also own a ton of Traveller Classic and MegaTraveller, including the TAS and Challenge Magazines.

Then there are newer RPG's like CthulhuTech and Eclipse Phase, I own all their books in print, so far. Including the newest updated copy of Eclipse Phases core rule book.

For Shadowrun 4E, I own everything released up through Seattle, and several things after that.

For Legends of the 5 Rings, not only do I own everything put out for it, but everything put out for 3E, 2E, D20 and most fo what was released for 1E, including all the boxed sets.

The description also holds for what I have of Shadowrun 1st to third editions.

Plus there are a ton more of RPG's I own that I haven't even mentioned, such as Paladium Fantasy, RIFTS, Mutants and Masterminds, Aces and Eights, Aftermath, Chivalry and Sorcery, and much, much more.

I seriously do not NEED to ever buy another RPG product. I really don't. I have plenty to last me several life times.

As for my credit card debt, I am well below the US average, and should have it all paid off once we get our tax return next February, and as for my house refinance? My interest is going down by 2.1% and is a VA refinance, so many fee's are waived. So well worth doing. A refinance I wouldn't even be able to do if it weren't for the government. Like I said, we are upside down on the mortgage, by a lot. So absolutely worth doing.

 

[TerraDave]

Rolling over credit card debt=problem

(that goes for all of you out there)

My main constraint is not money, but space and actually using the things I buy...which leads to these things to think about:

--Do you buy things that don't hold up through time as a resource, aid, reading material, etc?
--Do you buy things you don't use much in play (1 book for 1 feat problem)?
--Do you buy things you don't use in play at all?
--Do you buy things you don't read?
--Do you buy things that the % of using at all is small?
--Do you wish you had fewer game books, because you have those older ones you finally want to use at some point?
--Do you get something solely as a collectible, that doesn't have a serious "cool" factor to it?
--Do you get something solely as a collectible, that really isn't (ie its very easy to find, won't holds its value, doesn't meet the first criteria)

Basically, the closer the stuff you are getting gets towards the bottom of the list, the bigger the problem. I try to be at least in the middle (ie I read it) but I feel real remorse when not towards the top.

My favorite strategy is to take old unused stuff, sell it on Noble Knight (not 100% best price, but very easy) and then buy 1 cool thing that is really missing from my collection. Something that is actually worth owning, reading, using in play (if not exact mechanics..), inspires ideas...

 

[ggroy]

(At the risk of being misconstrued as edition warring).

In a sordid way, I'm actually glad the splatbook treadmills I previously was on, ended up ceasing within the last year or so. (4E D&D ceased this year, Mongoose Runequest 2 ceased last year, Mongoose Paranoia ceased last year, etc ..., and I ended up jumping off the Pathfinder treadmill when the second edition of the campaign setting book was released).


The only things I still collect regularly (non-rpg) are: old Star Trek novels (which I find at book sales, thrift stores, library discards, etc ... for around 50 cents each or less), and $5 bluray movies. (It turns out both are less expensive hobbies than my previous monthly rpg splatbook treadmills).

 

[TGryph]

I too used to buy WAY too much rpg material. Then one day decided enough was enough...I never even PLAYED many of these games. So I selected half a dozen systems to keep (at first), then promised myself the only way I would buy more game stuff is from the sale of my OLD game stuff. made life interesting..."Well, if I buy that old Runequest Boxed set, I will probably have to sell off my Buffy and Angel Core Books...". That and trades saw my collection whittle WAY down, so now instead of reading game systems I will never use, I spend that time working on my homebrew world and the various adventures set in it.

Oh, every now and again I will get something as a gift, or find a cheap book at a yard sale / used book store, but these almost always go to trade or auction to support my Runequest / OSR collection. I am now down to three lines (pre-3E D&D & their clones), Mongoose Traveller (2 books) and Runequest items in their various incarnations. And that's all I need.

TGryph