Falling Icicle
Adventurer
I'm still disappointed by the fighter's complete lack of social and exploration abilities.
D&D 5E The New Fighter
Klaus
First Post
Just because there isn't a list of fighting styles with the abilities for each level, doesn't mean the styles aren't there.
Marksman
1: Ricochet, Nimble Dodge
4: Nick
5: Volley
7: Hold Fast
Warlord
1: Strike Command, Warning Shout
4: Attack Orders
5: Whirlwind Attack
7: Bolster Allies
Protector
1: Slam, Block Missiles
4: Shield Swipe
5: Whirlwind Attack
7: Great Fortitude
TwoSix
Dirty, realism-hating munchkin powergamer
I like this idea a lot!
Klaus, I think you are missing the point. It was the having a list that I and others were referring to. That presorted list eased character creation, supplied a narrative, and could be used as inspiriation for your own customized style. Pretty much exactly the same as grouping feats into specialties. Yes all the abilities are there, but now we are spoiled and want are styles dangit. Incidently, this is part of the problem of offering bonus feats. They may clash with a character appropriate specialty and force a player to to dig through the feat section feat by feat to find a replacement. Thus impeding part of the usefulness of specialties. The same could be said of the rogues schemes and backgrounds last packet (or this one), but they are much easier and quicker to look through.
Back to the subject at hand. I think they should ditch the "dice" part of the fighters expertise entirely, simply making it say 2/battle or something similar. The rules would remain the same, but there would simply be no need for dice. Instead you would choose from a list of evocative and powerful abilities. EX:
-Critical Strike: You may declare one successful attack an automatic critical hit.
-Glancing Blow: You may deal half damage with a single missed melee attack. This does not trigger any additional effects from a succesful attack.
-Knick: You may deal half damage with a single missed ranged attack. This does not trigger any additional effects from a successful attack.
-Whirlwing Attack: You may spend an action to make a seperate melee attack against two enemies within your reach. Both attacks may gain the full benefit of your deadly strike.
-Rain of Arrows: You may spend an action to make a seperate ranged attack at up to three enemies within your weapons range. Each of these attacks gains the full benefit of deadly strike, but deals only half damage
(These two remove the need for the fighter's multiattack.)
-Parry: When wielding a melee weapon or shield you may use a reaction to grant disadvantage to a single attack against you.
-Warrior's Spirit: Become immune to the charmed and frightened condition for the next 10 minutes or until your next short rest, whichever comes first.
-Bolster Ally: Grant an ally advantage on a saving throw.
So on and so forth. These are just part of one long list instead of being seperated into 4 sub categories. Then the ones you gain are based on a fighting style, with the option to go a la carte instead.
Back to the subject at hand. I think they should ditch the "dice" part of the fighters expertise entirely, simply making it say 2/battle or something similar. The rules would remain the same, but there would simply be no need for dice. Instead you would choose from a list of evocative and powerful abilities. EX:
-Critical Strike: You may declare one successful attack an automatic critical hit.
-Glancing Blow: You may deal half damage with a single missed melee attack. This does not trigger any additional effects from a succesful attack.
-Knick: You may deal half damage with a single missed ranged attack. This does not trigger any additional effects from a successful attack.
-Whirlwing Attack: You may spend an action to make a seperate melee attack against two enemies within your reach. Both attacks may gain the full benefit of your deadly strike.
-Rain of Arrows: You may spend an action to make a seperate ranged attack at up to three enemies within your weapons range. Each of these attacks gains the full benefit of deadly strike, but deals only half damage
(These two remove the need for the fighter's multiattack.)
-Parry: When wielding a melee weapon or shield you may use a reaction to grant disadvantage to a single attack against you.
-Warrior's Spirit: Become immune to the charmed and frightened condition for the next 10 minutes or until your next short rest, whichever comes first.
-Bolster Ally: Grant an ally advantage on a saving throw.
So on and so forth. These are just part of one long list instead of being seperated into 4 sub categories. Then the ones you gain are based on a fighting style, with the option to go a la carte instead.
Rune
Once A Fool
I like your thinking here (and I wish they had included lists like this in the class description!), but I think the Warlord would work easily as well with Volley.
Chris_Nightwing
First Post
What I suggested elsewhere pretty much agrees with [MENTION=84383]kerleth[/MENTION]:
I propose a radical change to expertise dice: removing the dice. You start with 2 expertise, you spend them when you like, you recover them with a short rest. I would allow you to recover 1 expertise by forgoing your reaction rather than action, and you needn't have exhausted your expertise. You can spend lots at once if you like.
Death Dealer, aka do a damaging thing, pick from:
- use expertise to roll additional N [W], but don't use the lowest N (ala weapon mastery)
- deal [W] to an enemy adjacent to your target (ranged and melee versions)
- deal [Shield damage] to the target and impose disadvantage
- allies who hit your target get to use the weapon mastery effect, ie: you provide an opening (no reaction spending)
Superior Defence, aka do a defensive thing, pick from:
- use expertise and a shield to block an attack, imposing disadvantage
- parry with expertise to force enemy to roll additional [W] but don't use the highest [W] (reverse weapon mastery)
- use expertise and your reaction to impose disadvantage and if missed move away
- reduce damage of a hit ally by an effect using reverse weapon mastery
I could go on.. but you get the idea?
I would also add this: don't force us to pick one of these on a schedule, let us pick freely, let us pick maneuvers from the same pool without using feats, let the general fighter rule be "Use Expertise to get advantage on a maneuver check" be that pushing, tripping, blinding or whatever!
I propose a radical change to expertise dice: removing the dice. You start with 2 expertise, you spend them when you like, you recover them with a short rest. I would allow you to recover 1 expertise by forgoing your reaction rather than action, and you needn't have exhausted your expertise. You can spend lots at once if you like.
Death Dealer, aka do a damaging thing, pick from:
- use expertise to roll additional N [W], but don't use the lowest N (ala weapon mastery)
- deal [W] to an enemy adjacent to your target (ranged and melee versions)
- deal [Shield damage] to the target and impose disadvantage
- allies who hit your target get to use the weapon mastery effect, ie: you provide an opening (no reaction spending)
Superior Defence, aka do a defensive thing, pick from:
- use expertise and a shield to block an attack, imposing disadvantage
- parry with expertise to force enemy to roll additional [W] but don't use the highest [W] (reverse weapon mastery)
- use expertise and your reaction to impose disadvantage and if missed move away
- reduce damage of a hit ally by an effect using reverse weapon mastery
I could go on.. but you get the idea?
I would also add this: don't force us to pick one of these on a schedule, let us pick freely, let us pick maneuvers from the same pool without using feats, let the general fighter rule be "Use Expertise to get advantage on a maneuver check" be that pushing, tripping, blinding or whatever!
Salamandyr
Adventurer
OK, maybe it's just me, but I'm not seeing this. I complained long and hard about 3rd edition because the fighter (among other classes) received so few skill points that he basically could not interact with any section of the rules that didn't involve pulling out a sword and killing something (and they weren't even the best at that). I largely gave up playing 3rd edition because of that.
But the Next fighter doesn't have that problem. He has access to the same pool of abilities as everyone else, in the same amount, and they progress just as fast as everyone else. The fighter can be as persuasive as any class whose focus is not persuasion, there exploration abilities are as good as any class whose focus is not exploration, and whats more, if they want to be better, they don't lose much by crossfocussing their specialization.
I don't really understand what more they would need?
EDIT: thinking about it; some classes (other than the rogue who is supposed to be a "skills user") get special training in certain task actions or skills. I think this should be universalized, so every class gives you training in one or two skills, or advantage in certain tasks, in addition to the 4 you get for your background.
The fighter could get a choice from a handful of athletic, or observation based skills.
Last edited:
Jeff Carlsen
Adventurer
While both abilities in effect grant you the ability to target more than one creature, from a character perspective ranged and melee combat are very different, and I feel it's entirely appropriate to require a character to choose between them.
Similar Threads
