D&D 5E The new Dungeons & Dragons Starter Set - and online tools?

[Mistwell]

It had all the basics in it - chargen, magic, and ways to measure the success of an action. The 5e starter set doesn't. We played characters for several levels above the 3rd with the Moldvay edition. There's nothing to keep anyone from doing that.

Now you have declared a moving target. You defined crippleware one way, and then when challenged you shifted to another way. You said if it was intended to lead you to buy another product, if it was not complete, then it was crippleware. I already pointed out how it does not meet the definition you provided - levels 1 to 3, missing wilderness rules, and directly said in the book you should buy another book to get more levels and more rules for wilderness adventures. Are you now conceding it was a bad definition for this context?

 

[Rygar]

My Moldvay edition of D&D wasn't crippled. It had enough rules to play all aspects of the game.

The PHB is part of a set, not a standalone product.

Character generation is an intrinsic part of a roleplaying game.



So far, only a few have actively indicated that they disagree.

Whether people agree or not is irrelevant, anyway.

More than a few people. Thousands, potentially tens or hundreds of thousands. You see, Dragonlance is completely based on a set of modules that were designed around pre-generated characters, and was regarded as one of D&D's highest points. Those modules spawned nearly 30 years of novels more than a few of which hit the best seller lists of NYT. Then, as mistwell says there was the tournament modules, and the Solo series of modules.

 

[Hussar]

My Moldvay edition of D&D wasn't crippled. It had enough rules to play all aspects of the game.

From 1st to 3rd level and only if you only played in dungeons. Wouldn't it be considered cripple ware by your definition since it contained no rules for play outside of a dungeon?

 

[Ichneumon]

The chargen for the Starter Set is being outsourced. Creating new PCs with an online tool, app, or a document that didn't once live inside the box, doesn't 'cripple' the gaming experience in any way.

 

[mechascorpio]

I know very little about 5E, but I'm a bit perplexed by some of the concern regarding the products and the release schedule.

My friends and I started with the Holmes Basic Set in fall of '78, and we got AD&D Player's Handbooks a few months later, around Christmas break from school. I don't think we got the Monster Manual and certainly not the Dungeon Master's Guide until fall of '79. But we were totally able to play the game, run the few released modules and make up our own adventures for nearly a year without any other releases.

Back in the day, it seemed that the "Player's Handbook" was for all players, both the characters and the DM. The PH was The Rulebook for AD&D, and between that and what was introduced in the Basic Set, it seems we had everything we needed. Perhaps that's the same strategy (content-wise) for 5E and, in any case, we won't have to wait a year for the DM Guide.

Surely if we could do it 35 years ago, new players will be able to do it now, and experienced players have virtually no leap at all to make, yes?

 

[Hussar]

A further thought occurs since we are talking about Moldvay Basic. What chargen rules are included? You randomly roll stats and pick your class. There are no decision points after that.

How is that not playing with randomly assigned pregens?

 

[Henry]

Surely if we could do it 35 years ago, new players will be able to do it now, and experienced players have virtually no leap at all to make, yes?

Same point I made in another thread - it's nothing new - for goodness' sake, 3e was released each a month apart!

 

[PinkRose]

I just hope that if there are online tools, they have a block button like ENWorld has, because I have found that comes in very handy for those people that insist on trying to stir up trouble.

 

[Riley]

I don't know, or care, whether or not the Starter Set is "crippleware", but I am deeply disappointed that it does not include character generation.

Maybe it's because I hold Moldvay to be the platonic ideal of a starter set. Maybe it's because I've played a lot of D&D while camping. Maybe it's because my nearest FLGS/Encounters site is an hour and a half round trip. Maybe it's because I'm a bit of a bibliophile/Luddite.

Mostly, it is because at this point in my life, I want to play a quick, streamlined game that doesn't require 960 pages of rules. Or an internet connection.

Whatever. I really hope WOTC has a beautiful, free little character creation book(let) to go with the character-generation-free Starter Set. I have trouble imagining anything else that would be a good substitute for printed simple character generation/advancement rules.

 

[mechascorpio]

Maybe it's because I hold Moldvay to be the platonic ideal of a starter set.

I love(d) my Holmes and Moldvay sets too, and I definitely gravitate towards the BX or BECMI approach, and was hoping history might repeat. But they weren't really starter sets. Especially by the time Moldvay came out, they were a different game. I'm somewhat certain that at the time, most of us had both, but D&D (Basic) was one game, and AD&D was another.

Believe me, I'm also tempted to think that leaving out CG in the Starter is a mistake, but it's a "mistake" they've been making for years, for whatever reason. Completely new player hurdle? Pushing toward the big books? Cost of materials at the desired price point? No one will probably ever be frank enough to tell us, but probably all of the above and more.