D&D 5E Where are the Real Dragons?

[KarinsDad]

Can someone who might have gotten a peek into the DMG tell me if there are spellcaster templates in it?

Or possibly someone who might have gotten a hold of the MM tell me if there is something in the Dragon section to add Dragon spells?

I prefer Dragons to have spells. These brutes we've seen so far? Meh. I can add it myself, but it's better if WotC gives me an easy tool to use (taking into account XP, CR, etc.).

1E Dragons had spells, 2E and 3E had spells and theme spells, but 4E only had a little bit of theme powers (sometimes).

Now it looks like Dragons do not get any spells at all, random or theme. There's no magic to them at all.

These are flying breath weapon lizard creatures, not DRAGONS!!!

 

[fjw70]

I believe I saw someone with the MM saying that dragons can get up to 4th level spells. Don't know the details though.

 

[Paraxis]

Somewhere it has been mentioned that indeed the DMG will have rules for adding levels in PC classes to monsters, when it comes out just give dragons level in sorcerer.

Now while there are people out there that have the monster manual already, no one outside of WoTC has a DMG yet, and if they have a version of it they are under a NDA, so we just have to wait.

 

[lkj]

[MENTION=1927]Thaumaturge[/MENTION] confirmed that there is a variant to allow some spellcasting for dragons in the MM:

"A young or older dragon gets a number of spells equal to Chr mod. These are usable once per day. (There are a few sentences spelling out additional bits)."


I also have to think there will be modifications to add spellcasting to existing monsters in the DMG if you want a more full caster. But that's speculation.

AD

 

[Derren]

Can someone who might have gotten a peek into the DMG tell me if there are spellcaster templates in it?

Or possibly someone who might have gotten a hold of the MM tell me if there is something in the Dragon section to add Dragon spells?

I prefer Dragons to have spells. These brutes we've seen so far? Meh. I can add it myself, but it's better if WotC gives me an easy tool to use (taking into account XP, CR, etc.).

1E Dragons had spells, 2E and 3E had spells and theme spells, but 4E only had a little bit of theme powers (sometimes).

Now it looks like Dragons do not get any spells at all, random or theme. There's no magic to them at all.

These are flying breath weapon lizard creatures, not DRAGONS!!!

What? But that is so complex and hard to remember. How do you expect DMs to run monsters with physical attacks and spells?

 

[KarinsDad]

What? But that is so complex and hard to remember. How do you expect DMs to run monsters with physical attacks and spells?

Silly me.

 

[ZombieRoboNinja]

I hope that the MM will have a quick reference page with one-line mechanics for common monster spells. ("Fireball: 20ft radius within 150ft, 8d6 fire damage, Dex save for half")

 

[(Psi)SeveredHead]

Spellcasting dragons bore me. I like dragons being fierce and strong, but I don't like them being less-diverse spellcasting fiends.

If you tick off Smaug he's not going to cast a spell to find you, teleport into your bedroom and eat you. No, he's going to burn your town down. If you tick off a fiend, he will probably corrupt all your family and friends, destroy your reputation and sanity and then torture your soul for eternity.

This doesn't mean individual dragons can't be spellcasters, of course, if that's part of a specific dragon's personality or a specific type of dragon's powers. Does a red dragon really need to be able to cast Lightning Bolts or Mage Armor or Heal? She's already a huge engine of destruction with six attacks per round, incredibly hard scales and the ability to destroy armies just by breathing hard.

 

[John Q. Mayhem]

Mostly agreed, SeveredHead. I've usually made my own dragon stats in 3.X because every dragon being a mage is is so divorced from the source material I prefer. I'm glad to see it as optional rather than required for the default dragons.

 

[Derren]

Does a red dragon really need to be able to cast Lightning Bolts or Mage Armor or Heal?

Does a dragon need to cast telekinesis/mage hand to hold stuff, sending to contact minions not in speaking range or alter self to move around in human cities? If you do only want a simple combat encounter which stays put in its lair and waits for the PCs to show up then no, dragons do not need to cast anything.
But if you want them to be BBEGs who deserve the name and can do more things than flying around and stomp people then yes, they need spellcasting to cover the lack of hands or network/civilization they have.