What will happen to 4th edition?

[Balesir]

I see New Coke.

I never even got to taste "New Coke" - if I had done so and the new version seemed a better experience to me than the legacy version in every way, then the analogy might be apposite.

 

[billd91]

Hmmmmm, I don't mean to be a pessimist, but I think 4e is likely to be the deadest of all dead editions in the history of D&D. Its an outlier and it was never well-accepted.

That very outlier-liness might be the very thing that keeps 4e alive, albeit in a fairly small niche of D&D players. As you say, there's a dedicated set of fans - but it strikes me that the fans who like 4e seem to really like 4e because of the very elements that made it an outlier. That may help sustain the size of the player group, but whether it helps it grow or not, I can't predict.

 

[Neonchameleon]

Obviously 4e is done being developed, but do you think there is any chance of an errata'd edition being released sometime, even as pdfs? I don't know if WOTC is planning on continuing their release of 'classic' rules and supplements, so tis could be a moot question.

Not for another couple of years. I'm expecting everything to go up on Drivethru/D&D Classics in the end as not to do so would be leaving money on the table, but that's about it. But if WoTC doesn't want to support it I'm working on my Retroclone (to be OGL'd when released, following in OSRIC's footsteps)

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

That very outlier-liness might be the very thing that keeps 4e alive, albeit in a fairly small niche of D&D players. As you say, there's a dedicated set of fans - but it strikes me that the fans who like 4e seem to really like 4e because of the very elements that made it an outlier. That may help sustain the size of the player group, but whether it helps it grow or not, I can't predict.

Yeah, I'm sure there will be some sort of fan group for it, there's one for every game ever written, even terrible ones. From my perspective though it will be EFFECTIVELY dead if I can't raise a group to run for. In that case I'll probably just HAVE to either run 5e or stop playing D&D (which honestly my level of happiness with the larger D&D community tempts me to do, there are always other genre of RPG that I can bang my head against the table less about).

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

Not for another couple of years. I'm expecting everything to go up on Drivethru/D&D Classics in the end as not to do so would be leaving money on the table, but that's about it. But if WoTC doesn't want to support it I'm working on my Retroclone (to be OGL'd when released, following in OSRIC's footsteps)

It seems to me like there are a LOT of people that are dabbling in various flavors of 4e-esque retroclones. That's just it though, at this point I don't think any of them has much momentum or real likelihood of maturing into a solid product-level set of rules. Radiance RPG is about the closest thing, and I think that's diverged pretty far from 4e at this point. I know there are a few lonely souls, like yourself, working away on something. It is just at best too early to say that anything durable will come out of it all. I don't see a single project that has the sort of mind-share and stature that PF started with. Honestly I'm not sure there is anyone who's really focused enough to be making something that has any commercial potential or a goal to be commercial enough to build a real following around. Even the more out-there OSR games seem more robust in terms of following and leadership right now. I'm not even sure it makes sense for there to be a serious 4e retroclone.

 

[Werebat]

Maybe Paizo will ditch Pathfinder and rebrand 4e. I mean they'd have to buy the license first, I think, since 4e wasn't open source, but still.

Or maybe (more likely) some other company will do this.

Seriously, though -- in the end, what will happen to 4e is what happened to 2e.

 

[Werebat]

Yeah, I'm sure there will be some sort of fan group for it, there's one for every game ever written, even terrible ones. From my perspective though it will be EFFECTIVELY dead if I can't raise a group to run for. In that case I'll probably just HAVE to either run 5e or stop playing D&D (which honestly my level of happiness with the larger D&D community tempts me to do, there are always other genre of RPG that I can bang my head against the table less about).

I have, curiously, found Blood Bowl to involve far less tension, headache, and interpersonal strife than D&D and Pathfinder. Weird, since a large part of Blood Bowl is to kill the other guy's players.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

I have, curiously, found Blood Bowl to involve far less tension, headache, and interpersonal strife than D&D and Pathfinder. Weird, since a large part of Blood Bowl is to kill the other guy's players.

LOL, yeah, when it was first published it immediately led to a war in our group with my best buddy making up his own game that he called "Maceball" instead. You never know what gamers will fight about. Honestly I've had VERY little strife in RPGs in general as a personal thing. Its the community around D&D that just particularly was disappointing and unwelcome this time around. On the whole I have a poor opinion of it at this point. My own group and most of the players I encounter everyday IRL are fine. I just played in a 5e game with a new guy for 3 hours and he was quite fun.

 

[Manbearcat]

It will age gracefully like the fine wine that it is. Naturally.

Or it will turn into The Usual Suspects.

 

[Scrivener of Doom]

Hmmmmm, I don't mean to be a pessimist, but I think 4e is likely to be the deadest of all dead editions in the history of D&D. Its an outlier and it was never well-accepted. (snip)

It's my favourite edition from the 33+ years I have been playing but I do largely agree with these comments, and the other ones I snipped for the sake of brevity.

I see New Coke.

I think that makes sense...

I never even got to taste "New Coke" - if I had done so and the new version seemed a better experience to me than the legacy version in every way, then the analogy might be apposite.

... but this makes even more sense, in my experience. There is a lot to like about any of the non-4E editions - even in the Gygaxian shambles of 1E - but almost every time I see a thread on these or similar forums about a particular problem with the other editions, I cannot help but think how 4E resolved that successfully.

So, yes, while I accept that 4E is seen as the New Coke of D&D editions, I have to agree with Balesir et al that in my experience, it has been a better experience in almost every way.

Other than the crap it stirred up online, of course.

I have, curiously, found Blood Bowl to involve far less tension, headache, and interpersonal strife than D&D and Pathfinder. Weird, since a large part of Blood Bowl is to kill the other guy's players.

Killing players, eh? You guys sure do play for keeps.

By contrast, our D&D games across a range of editions have been largely free of interpersonal strife for 30-odd years: friends first, members of our D&D group second, and avoid public play like the plague.

LOL, yeah, when it was first published it immediately led to a war in our group with my best buddy making up his own game that he called "Maceball" instead. You never know what gamers will fight about. Honestly I've had VERY little strife in RPGs in general as a personal thing. Its the community around D&D that just particularly was disappointing and unwelcome this time around. On the whole I have a poor opinion of it at this point. My own group and most of the players I encounter everyday IRL are fine. I just played in a 5e game with a new guy for 3 hours and he was quite fun.

Commenting on the bit I have highlighted in bold, but wanting to preserve the other parts of the quote for context, I have to agree. Something went seriously wrong and the worst elements really took control of the biggest soapboxes.

It will age gracefully like the fine wine that it is. Naturally.

Or it will turn into The Usual Suspects.

I will go with the fine wine analogy, even though I am the only Australian in Asia who is not only NOT an alcoholic, but also a complete teatotaller.

And on the subject of ageing gracefully like a fine wine, 4E remains the only published edition of D&D where the quality of the products improved during the edition's life. The designers actually improved in their mastery of the rules whereas, with every other edition, the TSR/WotC designers' skills devolved. If only we had had another year....