D&D 5E DMing "Out of the Abyss"

[Celtavian]

There are a number of small, designed mini-adventures inside it, but it's not a complete, end-to-end adventure. (Nor is it a "module".) It is a campaign book.

Would you even want an adventure for levels 1-15 that fit inside a single book that size?

Given that seems the only adventures they are producing, then yes I would. They used to make modules like Fate of Istus about the same size with a well-designed and interesting adventure within the book. The original Temple of Elemental Evil was a similar size. It had a complete, fun adventure within it. There a are countless examples of complete, fun adventures that used to be produced by WotC that fit within a 32 page module that went for three or four levels. This book is 250. Seems they could fit some in a book that size.

 

[DMCF]

If any DM thinks the adventure asks for to much randomness and doesn't have the time to fill it I offer two suggestions and why!

1) level the characters to 3 or 4 quickly. I have 7 people and all but one are level 3. This is an encounters group and due to d&d release issues we only had time to prep harried in hills far and ran that 3 sessions. Tonight we started the campaign. I made sure they knew the drow were powerful by facing them off against 1 priestess and 5 elites when they were captured. This has them thinking "stealth and tricks".

The reason I did this is that I'm working with a time table. When you look at the NPC list most top out around CR 4. Fast leveling and the 5e power arch ensures that now my rather large party can go to virtually any location. If the fight is too easy I can enhance it with monsters and more exp. Now I can expedite some parts of the book and focus less on the random encounters (but i love the "save one npc or the other encounter idea!).

2) Talk to your players more in depth about their backgrounds. I have a dwarf searching for a lost clan hammer to lift a curse.

There is a halfling who once had a chaotic evil sentient mace and has murderous tendancies lingering after it was stolen.

Once i explained how Lloth is a demon but god through worship our Hillsfar 7int frat boy with a Hillsfarian man servant is collecting worshippers. Instead of sending him a new Jerry when one dies (long story) he adopts a follower who (due to abyssal chaos) takes on features of the old Jerry. The current one was a dwarf but the old was a human....now what if I throw in the Gcube later on?

The reason I do all this is because my players have as much, if not more imagination than I do. Most are younger and most are actually more experienced than I am at d&d. Because someone wondered if Iceshield orcs are blue, Ront's backstory is "Braveheart" up to where *spoiler* his wife is executed.

There are so many brains at your table it is a shame to use just one.

 

[DMCF]

Ok 1 more...Two other DMs helped me make madness cards and an NPC sheet with the short 1 line description and their picture. We handed it out to the groups and it really drove them to talk to them. We made it through about half and we'll be breaking out soon.

Think about the adventure. It is pretty open right? Do you have to blow your RP all in chapter 1? The Prince doesn't talk much. Neither does the Drow. The party tried to talm to them and even with successful charisma rolls got a paragraph sob story. The dwarf supplied the most information and stool was fun. My Bupido is insane with touretts hinting at *DMs know*. He's generally batsh*t crazy and will wander off in the middle of a conversation to take a nap.

The random encounters are possibilities for loot, player development and NPC development. As long as they get something, players seem to be pretty satisfied with each session. Our store lets us go to 10 sometimes so some of the kids have their moms picking them up regularly at that time. If we get kicked out we talk outside until everyone has a ride and do character development (no rolls since people are leaving).

 

[FormerlyHemlock]

I wouldn't worry about the extra NPCs. The part where the PCs are enslaved is there to set the stage and to get to know the NPCs. The ones they build rapport with and trust will hopefully survive and they can escape together. They might take to the calm, unassuming ones, or be impressed with the tough ones and figure (rightly so) that having them along will help them survive.

I wonder how Stool can possibly survive even the initial escape from the outpost, given that he has a movement rate of only 10'. Someone is going to have to carry the little guy to give him a chance.

 

[CapnZapp]

Is there a good guideline about PC level-up?

None.

This is patently false.

Many chapters discuss what levels are appropriate, and some even spend a sentence or two on what to do if the characters aren't quite there yet. Example:

Chapter 1: "Prisoners of the Drow" assumes the characters start at 1st level, and that they will achieve 2nd level if not 3rd by the end of this chapter of the adventure."
Chapter 7: "By the time they reach this point, the characters should be at least 7th level, having overcome challenges in their wild and dangeorus journey through the locations decribed in chapters 1 through 6."

But it is a sandbox. Meaning you're given a whole bunch of encounters, but no set path to play them in.

Blingdenstone? Or Gracklstugh? Could be reached at level 3. Or level 6. Or not at all. Same with every other descibed location. This doesn't mean the party can bypass all the adventure content, only that there is nothing described in chapters 3 through 6 that's essential to further play.

This means that one party might rush ahead and only be level N when a certain chapter is reached, while another party might fan out and explore everything (and by pure happenstance leave this particular chapter for last) and thus be level N+3.

But this is only a problem if you as the DM do not adapt. This is a sandbox. It is your job to monitor the PCs advance and insert certain key encounters at appropriate times.

That chapter 7 advice I quoted above? I read it this way:

"You should strive to have the characters reach this point only when they are at least 7th level"​

or

"Insert this chapter once the adventurers reach level 7"​

See the difference?

If you expect to just go from page 23 to 24 to 25 in order, boy, you're in for a massive disappointment. This is an adventure for a DM who likes juggling half a dozen alternatives at the same time.

So, really, that party rushing ahead? It won't reach foes that stomp on them because they're only level N. Not unless you make it so. Your job is to seamlessly insert enough of the material given so this only happens if you want it to happen.

The module tells you to do this in various places. But it expects experienced DMs, and so it doesn't spend much time detailing how. This is a sandbox. What it does is throw plenty of random tables at you, and a couple of "set pieces" as well. What you do with these is, however, entirely up to you. As far as the adventure goes, the only criteria is "have at it until they're level seven".

In this particular case, the key to "but how do I keep the party just aimlessly wandering when all they want to do is escape to the surface?" is discussed, but not until chapter 7. So you can't just postpone reading it until the party "gets there". Because they won't ever "get there" unless you make it so. And you need to read up on this chapter and in particular the discussion on "Finding the Way" already as soon as the party is about to escape the Drow outpost.

Prep well and you shall be rewarded.

Try to run it like a rollercoaster and... well, I simply suggest you don't. Why?

Because this is a sandbox.

 

[CapnZapp]

That's what I'm gathering as well. I was planning on going with the Milestone method on this, but it seems that with no guidelines on when best to do it, awarding XP is the way to go in this adventure.

Or, you could level-up after each chapter.

There. I did it.

It wasn't in the adventure, but it was still easy, meaning, no, there is no hand-holding going on in this adventure. Experienced DMs find awarding levels milestone-style easy, and this is an adventure for experienced DMs.

You might think I'm fooling around. But actually, I kind of am serious. After all there are 17 chapters in the book. Even if you were to follow my off hand advice to the letter (chapter?) and even if your players refuse to bypass even a single chapter, you could do far worse than having the party be 17th level at the end.

I don't mean you need to be some kind of genius. It's not elitist crap like that.

This isn't one of those 4th edition dungeon delves where everything is laid out for you, and where you can simply jump in at a moment's notice, no.

By "experienced" I mean "will accept to read through a 250 page module well in advance of play, will accept having to make notes and juggle potential outcomes in your head". I mean DMs who have DMd before, who knows how to spot encounters where the party is outclassed, who knows how to improvise on the spot, who can keep scores of NPCs apart.

In essence, what I mean is DMs who take their time. I'm confident you the reader can do it, for example. Even I can do it!

 

[Celtavian]

This is patently false.

Many chapters discuss what levels are appropriate, and some even spend a sentence or two on what to do if the characters aren't quite there yet. Example:

Chapter 1: "Prisoners of the Drow" assumes the characters start at 1st level, and that they will achieve 2nd level if not 3rd by the end of this chapter of the adventure."
Chapter 7: "By the time they reach this point, the characters should be at least 7th level, having overcome challenges in their wild and dangeorus journey through the locations decribed in chapters 1 through 6."

But it is a sandbox. Meaning you're given a whole bunch of encounters, but no set path to play them in.

Blingdenstone? Or Gracklstugh? Could be reached at level 3. Or level 6. Or not at all. Same with every other descibed location. This doesn't mean the party can bypass all the adventure content, only that there is nothing described in chapters 3 through 6 that's essential to further play.

This means that one party might rush ahead and only be level N when a certain chapter is reached, while another party might fan out and explore everything (and by pure happenstance leave this particular chapter for last) and thus be level N+3.

But this is only a problem if you as the DM do not adapt. This is a sandbox. It is your job to monitor the PCs advance and insert certain key encounters at appropriate times.

That chapter 7 advice I quoted above? I read it this way:

"You should strive to have the characters reach this point only when they are at least 7th level"​

or

"Insert this chapter once the adventurers reach level 7"​

See the difference?

If you expect to just go from page 23 to 24 to 25 in order, boy, you're in for a massive disappointment. This is an adventure for a DM who likes juggling half a dozen alternatives at the same time.

So, really, that party rushing ahead? It won't reach foes that stomp on them because they're only level N. Not unless you make it so. Your job is to seamlessly insert enough of the material given so this only happens if you want it to happen.

The module tells you to do this in various places. But it expects experienced DMs, and so it doesn't spend much time detailing how. This is a sandbox. What it does is throw plenty of random tables at you, and a couple of "set pieces" as well. What you do with these is, however, entirely up to you. As far as the adventure goes, the only criteria is "have at it until they're level seven".

In this particular case, the key to "but how do I keep the party just aimlessly wandering when all they want to do is escape to the surface?" is discussed, but not until chapter 7. So you can't just postpone reading it until the party "gets there". Because they won't ever "get there" unless you make it so. And you need to read up on this chapter and in particular the discussion on "Finding the Way" already as soon as the party is about to escape the Drow outpost.

Prep well and you shall be rewarded.

Try to run it like a rollercoaster and... well, I simply suggest you don't. Why?

Because this is a sandbox.

I'll see if it is a well done sandbox after I read it some more. A sandbox can lead to a really poor adventure experience if done poorly.

 

[Nemio]

I ordered this adventure because my players are getting close to the end of the Starter Set and this adventure appealed to me more than the others that were already released.

I'm getting a bit scared though after reading this is for experienced DM's.
I only have about 7 sessions under my belt and don't consider myself that experienced yet.
But perhaps this is the best way to learn and improve?

 

[CapnZapp]

I'll see if it is a well done sandbox after I read it some more. A sandbox can lead to a really poor adventure experience if done poorly.

Completely true.

If I made it sound like Outta is the best thing since sliced bread, I apologize [emoji6]

 

[Guest 6801328]

Is the definition of "Sandbox" really "a handful of set-piece encounters that may be tackled in various sequences, with random encounter tables in between"?