Christian Persecution vs Persecuted Christians

[Maxperson]

Odds are a black person will have a harder time finding housing than a white person. A white person doesn't need to be racist to benefit from that. Being white comes with the privilege of having less odds of being discriminated when looking for housing.

Odds are a black person will face jail time if he/she is found with marijuana on their person and that jail time will be longer. A white person has less odds of facing jail time they are found with pot on them, and if they end up in jail, odds are their time there will be shorter.

Odds are that I will have a harder time finding housing than another white person if I dress in baggy pants and a t-shirt. Odds are that if a white guy dressed in that same baggy pants walks into a car dealership next to a middle eastern man in a button down shirt, slacks and dress shoes, that white guy will be ignored.

People in professions that deal with money profile based on economics, not color. They do it because it works. If it didn't, they wouldn't do it. Sometimes they will misjudge someone doing it that way, but not so often that it doesn't make sense to continue the practice.

It's unfortunate, but as a whole the black and hispanic communities are economically worse off. I'm not talking about disparity in the same job as a white person where both are equally qualified. That's racism. I'm talking about the much higher drop-out rates that black and hispanic people have when compared to the white community. That's a cultural/social difference that results in most of the economic disparity. Drop outs who work as grocery clerks are not going to make as much as educated people.

White privilege isn't the problem, and it really doesn't exist. Most of what is called white privilege is racism and/or economic in nature. What needs to be done is to shift the views of the black and hispanic communities so that they view education as more important than they currently view it and become more educated. If they shift their attitudes towards education, they will simultaneously shift their economic situation higher and the "white privilege" issues will be greatly diminished. Racism will never be gotten rid of completely.

Please note that I'm not saying that every individual in those communities holds that general view. There are many individuals who do value education and they are making far more than the bulk of their community.

Oh, and just to drive the point home that economics is the major issue, I will also face far more jail time than a rich person who is accused of the same crime. Even simple drug accusations. Money matters. I couldn't get away with a tenth of what Lindsey Lohan and other rich and famous people get away with on a regular basis.

 

[Maxperson]

I have a cousin serving 30 years in Angola prison for his first offense, armed robbery. It is utterly undisputed by the prosecution that he was passed out cold in the getaway car when the robbery occurred, and had been for some time previous.

Under the law, persons who are co-conspirators can be given the same sentence as those who commit the crime in principal. However, that requires certain amounts of proof...including whether or not the co-conspirator was still a participant in the conspiracy.

http://www.cnn.com/2013/12/04/justice/exonerated-prisoner-update-michael-morton/

http://listverse.com/2013/03/27/10-people-who-were-wrongfully-accused-of-heinous-crimes/

Prosecutors do screwed up things and it happens very often to white people, too. They are zealous and often ignore evidence in order to get convictions.

That said, I do understand that there is a disproportionate number of black people in jail for crimes that white people are accused of. This country has a lot of racism that still needs to go away. That racism results in the disparity between white and black inmates, not some deliberate privilege being accorded to people who are white.

 

[Dannyalcatraz]

Odds are that I will have a harder time finding housing than another white person if I dress in baggy pants and a t-shirt. Odds are that if a white guy dressed in that same baggy pants walks into a car dealership next to a middle eastern man in a button down shirt, slacks and dress shoes, that white guy will be ignored.

And

White privilege isn't the problem, and it really doesn't exist.

http://metro.co.uk/2015/04/30/racis...nd-white-person-in-the-united-states-5175699/
This has nothing to do with clothes.

I don't shop in raggedy clothing. Odds are- unless I'm going play volleyball or to the gym- I'm wearing over $3000 in clothing & jewelry. My Dad wears a sportscoat (or suit), tie and french cuffs every weekday, as do I whenever I'm with clients or in court.

It doesn't matter what we wear, we routinely get ignored at car dealerships. As in, that is our norm, not an exception.

Controlling for all non-racial factors, blacks pay $700 more per automobile than do whites, are 50% more likely to be stopped by police while driving, and less likely to be responded to by politicians or potential employers.

Prosecutors do screwed up things and it happens very often to white people, too. They are zealous and often ignore evidence in order to get convictions.

Again, "white privilege" does not mean that nothing bad happens to Caucasians, but rather, certain bad things happen to minorities at rates much higher than would be predicted in race-neutral probability studies. As the vid linked to above points out, despite marijuana use being statistically identical between blacks and whites, blacks are 4x more likely to do jail time.

As someone who worked (briefly) in Texas' public defender's system, that isn't just because of juries. Whites are far more likely to be offered plea deals and never see a jury than are blacks or Hispanics.

 

[Homicidal_Squirrel]

Heh... a paralegal VS lawyer discussion. This should be interesting.

 

[Kramodlog]

White privilege isn't the problem, and it really doesn't exist. Most of what is called white privilege is racism and/or economic in nature.

Wouldn't you say that being white makes you less likely the target/victim of racism and that is a privilege that comes with being white? That being heterosexual makes you less likely to be the target/vitim of discrimination? Or cisgender. Or being a man.

You focus a lot on race, but privilege isn't just about race.

What needs to be done is to shift the views of the black and hispanic communities so that they view education as more important than they currently view it and become more educated. If they shift their attitudes towards education, they will simultaneously shift their economic situation higher and the "white privilege" issues will be greatly diminished.

Yeah, no racial stereotypes here. Might as well say Asians value education and do not face racism because of it.

 

[Ovinomancer]

Wouldn't you say that being white makes you less likely the target/victim of racism and that is a privilege that comes with being white? That being heterosexual makes you less likely to be the target/vitim of discrimination? Or cisgender. Or being a man.

You focus a lot on race, but privilege isn't just about race.

Yeah, no racial stereotypes here. Might as well say Asians value education and do not face racism because of it.

It's now a privilege to not be a victim?!

 

[Maxperson]

Wouldn't you say that being white makes you less likely the target/victim of racism and that is a privilege that comes with being white? That being heterosexual makes you less likely to be the target/vitim of discrimination? Or cisgender. Or being a man.

Less likely? Sure. A privilege? No. A privilege is something others deliberately grant you. Nor are any of those things you mentioned limited to white people, so it's not even something special to them. Not once in my life have I been pulled aside by a white conspiracy and told to extend privileges like these to other white people. Nor have I heard mention of it from any of my white friends.

You focus a lot on race, but privilege isn't just about race.

Why would I focus on other things in a conversation about white privilege?

 

[Maxperson]

And


http://metro.co.uk/2015/04/30/racis...nd-white-person-in-the-united-states-5175699/
This has nothing to do with clothes.

I don't shop in raggedy clothing. Odds are- unless I'm going play volleyball or to the gym- I'm wearing over $3000 in clothing & jewelry. My Dad wears a sportscoat (or suit), tie and french cuffs every weekday, as do I whenever I'm with clients or in court.

It doesn't matter what we wear, we routinely get ignored at car dealerships. As in, that is our norm, not an exception.

That's still economic profiling, which is fairly accurate. I don't for a minute believe that that many people are so blatantly racist that they are ignoring you guys based solely on skin color. Some probably are, but the majority of those salesmen are trying to make money and if they thought that black people were as a whole, as economically sound as white people, you wouldn't be getting ignored like that.

Controlling for all non-racial factors, blacks pay $700 more per automobile than do whites, are 50% more likely to be stopped by police while driving, and less likely to be responded to by politicians or potential employers.

Color does play a role in those things. How many of those stopped by police are in primarily black communities where black crime is high? I'm not saying that stopping people based on color is right, but often race does play a logical role in things. When 90% of illegal immigrants are hispanic, it's logical, not racist to use 90% of your anti-illegal immigration resources targeting illegal hispanics. It's not racist, because it's just responding to factual numbers. Numbers also play a role in being responded to by politicians. In the vast majority of elections, Obama's election being the aberration, black people haven't turn out to vote as much as white people do. I'm also curious to know if black politicians ignore black constituents.

I don't have enough knowledge of employers or what might contribute to paying more for cars other than just race, so I'm not going to respond further on those comments.

Again, "white privilege" does not mean that nothing bad happens to Caucasians, but rather, certain bad things happen to minorities at rates much higher than would be predicted in race-neutral probability studies. As the vid linked to above points out, despite marijuana use being statistically identical between blacks and whites, blacks are 4x more likely to do jail time.

As someone who worked (briefly) in Texas' public defender's system, that isn't just because of juries. Whites are far more likely to be offered plea deals and never see a jury than are blacks or Hispanics.

What do you mean by statistically identical? Same percentage of each population, or same approximate total number of users?

 

[Kramodlog]

A privilege is something others deliberately grant you.

I'm not sure where you get that privileges are things that are all consciously given. For example, first impressions aren't always a concious rational process.

Nor are any of those things you mentioned limited to white people,

I didn't say it is limited to white people. And, again, I'll say that it doesn't mean that individuals who are part of a demographics that has some privileges can't face discrimination either.

What I said is that odds favor men, white people, heterosexuals, cisgender people... And you agree that this, so I'm not sure what your issue is. If you want to say privilege is not an ideal word or concept, I agreed with that in an earlier post. Do you have a better word to suggest to discribe real social phenomenoms?

Why would I focus on other things in a conversation about white privilege?

Because the post that started the conversation did exclusively focus on skin color. It was, surprisingly, about privileges another poster has. Those can include skin color, but also gender, sexual orientation, gender identity... http://www.enworld.org/forum/showth...tians/page36&p=6740422&viewfull=1#post6740422

 

[Kramodlog]

I don't for a minute believe that that many people are so blatantly racist that they are ignoring you guys based solely on skin color.

And here is the crux of the issue. That the relatively discrimination free* life you enjoy prevents you from believing that other people face discrimination based on stupid things like skin color, gender or sexual orientation.


*That doesn't mean bad things do not happen to you.