Converting First Edition Monsters

[freyar]

OK, you've sold me on it. It seems awkward, so maybe they should be secondary weapons or something. And add in something like barbed defense?

 

[Cleon]

OK, you've sold me on it. It seems awkward, so maybe they should be secondary weapons or something. And add in something like barbed defense?

The spines are the only things listed on the AD&D Pungi's attack & damage lines, but I can certainly see them as being ungainly enough to be secondary weapons - they're on the fish's back, after all.

Oh, and I was definitely going for the "barbed defense" approach.

I'm thinking a dodecahedron or two might feature in the latter, as a substitute for the original's No. of Attacks: 1-12.

 

[freyar]

OK, it seems we're agreed on making them a secondary attack. Same damage as for the spiny defense or a bit less?

 

[Cleon]

OK, it seems we're agreed on making them a secondary attack. Same damage as for the spiny defense or a bit less?

I desire a delightful dodecahedron.

Speaking of that Spiny Defense, should we make it vary depending on the size of the creature, to homage the original's one-spike-per-square-foot approach?

 

[freyar]

Wouldn't it just go up with size advancement as usual? But I'd be happy to go with 1d12+Con or even 2d12 if you wanted for spiny defense.

 

[Cleon]

Wouldn't it just go up with size advancement as usual? But I'd be happy to go with 1d12+Con or even 2d12 if you wanted for spiny defense.

I meant the size of the creature stepping on it, not the size of the Pungi Ray being stepped upon.

 

[freyar]

Oh. Hmmm. That seems a bit awkward, and I'd think we'd have to do a table, so the damage levels off if the stepping creature is so large that its foot is bigger than the ray.

 

[Cleon]

Oh. Hmmm. That seems a bit awkward, and I'd think we'd have to do a table, so the damage levels off if the stepping creature is so large that its foot is bigger than the ray.

Hmm... I can see us making it something simple. Say, the damage depends on the size of the creature stepping on the Ray.

e.g.

Huge or larger - 2d12
Large - 2d8
Medium - 1d12
Small - 1d8
Tiny or smaller - 1d4

We could also expand the range and add a cap based on the Ray's size to allow for Pungi rays of larger or smaller size. e.g.

Colossal - 4d12 (max damage for Huge rays)
Gargantuan - 4d8 (max damage for Large rays)
Huge - 2d12 (max damage for Medium rays)
Large - 2d8
Medium - 1d12
Small - 1d8
Tiny or smaller - 1d4

 

[freyar]

You know, I'm just not feeling it. I'm going to guess that other critters with spiny/barbed defense has similar "attacks per size" mechanisms originally that got removed in 3.X. In fact, I'm pretty sure we did that for some hazards, though I don't think any of our "recent" hazard conversions ever made it to the actual CC, which means I can't search easily.

 

[Cleon]

You know, I'm just not feeling it. I'm going to guess that other critters with spiny/barbed defense has similar "attacks per size" mechanisms originally that got removed in 3.X. In fact, I'm pretty sure we did that for some hazards, though I don't think any of our "recent" hazard conversions ever made it to the actual CC, which means I can't search easily.

I'd be OK making it a single damage figure regardless of size in keeping with standard 3E.

It's not like we haven't got precedent - for example, some old D&D versions of caltrops have variable damage, and they do single figure damage in 3E.

Actually, that gives me an idea. Should we give it "the creature’s speed is reduced by one-half because its foot is wounded" like a caltrop?