D&D 5E I just don't see why they even bothered with the Sword Coast Adventurer's Guide.

[Gnashtooth]

So after several years now with this new Realms, it's actually become far worse than it was in 4th.

#1 They blatantly throw away any kind of setting cohesion in favor of cramming more stuff in

#2 marketing and media are far more important than pleasing returning fans.

#3 the people they are selling this wishy-washy material to just don't care. FR locations are just buzzwords to these people. The people I'm referring to are probably not even reading threads like this. This is the casual, non-vocal crowd we never hear from.

So rule zero of 2015 realms is, "Pile on the stupid, because nobody's supposed to be watching. But if you /are/ watching, f--- you for paying attention."

I don't blame any of the designers for this, this is clearly the marketing department trying to shove the lowest common denominator down our throats (hence why Dragon+ is just more marketing spam rehashed.)

Side note: To the above posters, keep in mind that AD&D drove the business at TSR, not so for either WotC or Hasbro.

 

[Corpsetaker]

Right, because doing what was good for the customer and not what was good for them worked really well for TSR. Which, by the way, was also a corporation.

Sorry but big release schedules was not what killed TSR. Please get off the band wagon and actually take a look at what wagon you are trying to jump on. There was a "lot" going on in TSR that killed it. TSR's releases were something that would have been better served today with the ease of buying we have now as to back then.

 

[Corpsetaker]

One thing I found funny was with the Arcana domain. They talk about other gods who have access to it in other settings and bring up the 3 gods of magic in Krynn then in the section detailing adapting the content to dragonlance they state that the 3 gods don't have clerics and so don't grant the arcana domain.

They also mention there being temples to other deities such as Velsharoon in Mulmaster and yet he isn't listed in the deities section. So a new person may wonder who this Velsharoon is but will find no lore on him in the book.

 

[pukunui]

So a new person may wonder who this Velsharoon is but will find no lore on him in the book.

And you don't think having people wonder about a few things is a good thing? I like that WotC isn't giving us hard-coded "facts" for every little thing mentioned in the book. There's a newfound sense of mystery and wonder in it that is absent from the more DM-oriented "this is how it actually is" products of the past. They're giving us space to provide our own answers, to write our own stories. "Who is Velsharoon?" "I dunno. Let's make something up!"

 

[Irennan]

Having flicked through the book last night, I think it is decent value for money. A few things have made me wonder just how much lore I've missed over the years. For instance, Bhaal is alive again; the book referenced murder in Baldur's gate regarding his return but I have no idea how Myrkul made it out of the dead book.

One thing I found funny was with the Arcana domain. They talk about other gods who have access to it in other settings and bring up the 3 gods of magic in Krynn then in the section detailing adapting the content to dragonlance they state that the 3 gods don't have clerics and so don't grant the arcana domain.

The explanation for any changes concerning gods and their return, or lands being swapped is ''Ao did it''. Mystra, Bhaal, Helm, Mask and Azuth seem to be the exception, given that they received rather extensive coverage (or are going to, in the case of Azuth).

 

[Corpsetaker]

And you don't think having people wonder about a few things is a good thing? I like that WotC isn't giving us hard-coded "facts" for every little thing mentioned in the book. There's a newfound sense of mystery and wonder in it that is absent from the more DM-oriented "this is how it actually is" products of the past. They're giving us space to provide our own answers, to write our own stories. "Who is Velsharoon?" "I dunno. Let's make something up!"

I'm sorry but an established setting like the Forgotten Realms shouldn't be published as a "let's make things up like who is Velsharoon". Sure you can homebrew anything you like in FR but if you are going to publish the setting then it needs to be correct.

 

[pukunui]

I'm sorry but an established setting like the Forgotten Realms shouldn't be published as a "let's make things up like who is Velsharoon".

I quite like the "less is more" approach WotC is taking with the Realms. I *like* that they're not dotting every I and crossing every T. I *like* that they're not spoonfeeding me every single little dribble of lore from the past 30 years. I *like* that they're giving me space to breathe and spread my wings and truly make the setting my own - and by that I mean, they're leaving space for me to fill in the details instead of giving me everything and then expecting me to change it if I don't like it or if it doesn't fit. It also means I'm less likely to have one of my players say, "Well, actually ..."

Sure you can homebrew anything you like in FR but if you are going to publish the setting then it needs to be correct.

WotC owns the setting. They get to decide what is correct.

 

[Hussar]

I agree because while there are certainly lessons to be learnt from TSR there are greater existing challenges from WotC business structure like for example trying to produce products without any Editors on staff. Now that is an example of a problem TSR never suffered from in any meaningful sense.

Snort. Have you read TSR era books? You have a definition of suffer that is far different from mine.

I just want to say that I don't believe that BS that Mearls said for an instant.

Reasons:

1: If the way 3rd edition was handled was bad then how come it lasted so long and still exists in the guise of Pathfinder which has spawned it's own following?

2: 4th edition was bad for 4th edition and not some over zealous release schedule. So many people simply didn't like the rules so they bought less books.

When you have a fantastic rule set then books are purchased on the back of that. That whole thing Mearls said is nothing but new edition strategy justification spin. 5th edition is a fantastic ruleset that many people obviously enjoy so if you picked up the pace on books then those books will be purchased. You also can't go in with the corporate attitude that every book you put forth is supposed to sell more copies than the last.

The sad thing is, since a corporation has taken over D&D it stopped being about what's good for the customer and more what's good for the corporation and in so doing this, has made people believe that their current strategy is what's best for the game when it's actually not.

So Mike Mearls, here are the things that are bad for D&D: Corporations, profits treadmills, and bad spin.

So, we're back to everything coming from WotC is a lie. Ok. Things like pesky facts that someone like Mearls is in a position to actually make informed statements just don't matter. What they say doesn't jive with your preconceived notions, so, therefore, he's lying.

If 3e was handled so fantastically, why have we had THREE versions of 3e in 15 years? Never mind new editions of D&D, just a single edition has been rewritten extensively, and, oh look, another PHB/DMG/MM trinity released, three times in the past 15 years. How is this not a treadmill? Oh, and let's not forget, we're likely going to have a FOURTH version of 3e before the end of the decade. Four versions of a single edition in 20 years. Goodie.

 

[Parmandur]

I don't believe that to be true. Kickstarter is not an online vendor, the way Amazon is. When you pledge to a Kickstarter, you're not making a pre-order, nor is there any impetus for a Kickstarter for a particular book to include sending you a physical copy as a reward (even if virtually all of them do, at some particular pledge level).



Rather, Kickstarter is a crowd-sourced method of venture capitalism; the money you pledge goes into producing the book, which would presumably not come into existence otherwise. Once it has the money to pay for production, there's absolutely nothing stopping it from being sold via traditional retail outlets (at least, notwithstanding its contents, etc.).

Well, it is not venture investment: backers do not get ownership, they get delivery of a product.

Not knocking it, I like it. But it takes business away from local stores, just the way it is, per my understanding from the retailers themselves. And WOTC is all about the stores.

 

[Parmandur]

WOTC makes decisions good for their business, and good for the game secondarily (the two ought to coincide, mainly).

TSR made terrible decisions, for themselves and customers. Kinda across the board, except by accident.