transtemporal
Explorer
Oh, I was hoping for a single DC to defeat the Undermountain skill challenge. Something like "You roll a 20, you won Undermountain!" 
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D&D 5E Undermountain as a Skill Challenge
- Thread starter Charles Rampant
- Start date
It's an interesting idea, but I feel like it reduces the vastness and mystery of Undermountain to a few generic dice rolls. There's no difference between trying to get to White Plume dungeon through Undermountain or through generic journey X. I think you could definitely do something like this, but you would want to maintain more of the sense of travel, include decisions and interesting locations along the way, make decisions affect later results, and overall just make it more engaging.
As an example of what I'm thinking, you could have a system something like the following:
Journey Table (roll d20 at the start of the journey)
Natural 1. Disaster! All rolls on the Events table suffer a -1 penalty. Roll again on the Journey table.
2-9 Lost. The guide was incompetent, the directions were wrong, or you just took the wrong turn. Roll 3 times on the Events table to get back to a familiar spot, then roll again on the Journey table.
10-14 Difficult journey. Undermountain has conspired against you. Roll 5 times on the Events table.
13-19 Normal journey. About what you expected. You encounter normal challenges in reaching your destination. Roll 3 times on the Events table.
20+ Excellent journey. The guide does a masterful job of getting you to your location. Roll 1 time on the Events table
6-10 Normal journey. About what you expected. You encounter normal challenges in reaching your destination. Roll 3 times on the Events table.
Events Table (d20)
1 Ambush! The party encounters a wandering encounter. Roll on the wandering monster table. The party suffers disadvantage on Perception rolls to avoid surprise.
2 Enemies. The party encounters a wander encounter. Roll on the wandering monster table.
3 Trap! The party stumbles into a trap. Roll on the trap table.
4 Chasm. The party's path is obstructed by a vast chasm. The party needs to either cross the chasm (skill checks, Fly, etc) or backtrack and return to the Journey table.
5 Sanctuary. The party comes across a safe place to rest. The party can take a long rest without risking any wandering encounters.
6 Shifting halls. Halaster's dungeon has shifted, throwing off directions to the destination. If the guide can make a skill check, the party is able to successfully navigate past the shifting halls. Otherwise add 2 more rolls on the Events table.
etc.
The above is just a rough idea, but it maintains the feeling of a journey, it gives you places where choices can affect the journey, it maintains the feeling of Undermountain, and it doesn't trivialize a trip through one of the most infamous and iconic dungeons in the history of the game. And of course it does it without relying on mapping, which is what you want.
As an example of what I'm thinking, you could have a system something like the following:
Journey Table (roll d20 at the start of the journey)
Natural 1. Disaster! All rolls on the Events table suffer a -1 penalty. Roll again on the Journey table.
2-9 Lost. The guide was incompetent, the directions were wrong, or you just took the wrong turn. Roll 3 times on the Events table to get back to a familiar spot, then roll again on the Journey table.
10-14 Difficult journey. Undermountain has conspired against you. Roll 5 times on the Events table.
13-19 Normal journey. About what you expected. You encounter normal challenges in reaching your destination. Roll 3 times on the Events table.
20+ Excellent journey. The guide does a masterful job of getting you to your location. Roll 1 time on the Events table
6-10 Normal journey. About what you expected. You encounter normal challenges in reaching your destination. Roll 3 times on the Events table.
Events Table (d20)
1 Ambush! The party encounters a wandering encounter. Roll on the wandering monster table. The party suffers disadvantage on Perception rolls to avoid surprise.
2 Enemies. The party encounters a wander encounter. Roll on the wandering monster table.
3 Trap! The party stumbles into a trap. Roll on the trap table.
4 Chasm. The party's path is obstructed by a vast chasm. The party needs to either cross the chasm (skill checks, Fly, etc) or backtrack and return to the Journey table.
5 Sanctuary. The party comes across a safe place to rest. The party can take a long rest without risking any wandering encounters.
6 Shifting halls. Halaster's dungeon has shifted, throwing off directions to the destination. If the guide can make a skill check, the party is able to successfully navigate past the shifting halls. Otherwise add 2 more rolls on the Events table.
etc.
The above is just a rough idea, but it maintains the feeling of a journey, it gives you places where choices can affect the journey, it maintains the feeling of Undermountain, and it doesn't trivialize a trip through one of the most infamous and iconic dungeons in the history of the game. And of course it does it without relying on mapping, which is what you want.
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Charles Rampant
Adventurer
It sounds like people agree on the idea, but not on the very simple tables. I can see that. It's certainly too abstract in my initial version, I'd agree. Something that both [MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION] and [MENTION=913]Schmoe[/MENTION] mention is bringing out the flavour more heavily; I wonder if bringing in a very limited element of mapping could help. I'm struggling to think of how to describe this.
Okay, so here is the grand map of Undermountain. From my understanding, only parts of this ever received full 5' squares maps; Dungeon, Storeroom, Sargauth for the main levels, and some of the random smaller parts.
Now, say that we use that first map as our basis. We can have three starting points, for current discussion - Yawning Portal, Sewers, Citadel (which is under the Castle, presumably for extra plot fruitiness). The party wants to get to a dungeon, and they have learned that it is on the first level. So we look at our special reference map thingy, and see that they'd pass through two zones - Entrance (whichever one they use), and 1st. Each of these could have specific events tables associated with them, and each require the Guide to make a roll to determine how many events were met, using multiple sub-tables as suggested. If, however, the party want to get to The Maze Level, and they've discovered The Shaft, then they would need to travel through six zones - Entrance, Dungeon, Storeroom, Sargauth, Shaft, Maze. Again, each comes with its (specific?) table of Stuff, including combat encounters, traps, portals (that might act as permanent shortcuts, so that the party can always in the future get from Dungeon to Maze without any intervening steps, for example).
If this was the method taken, I wonder if having discreet roles for party members at all is that helpful. You're already getting beyond the level of abstraction used in AiME or 4e Skill Challenges. Instead, it might be simpler to have "The Party" make a roll of 1d20+proficiency bonus to act as the Guide roll, and then have that prompt a number of events, each of which would be phrased like...
"One party member must make an DC20 Arcana check to decipher the runes on this door, or the party will be forced to return to the previous level and try to find another path."
"Two party members must make Athletics checks at DC10 to help cross a chasm; each failure will give one party member a level of Exhaustion, as they fall and must be retrieved."
Does this sound more... Undermountainy than the abstract method I proposed in the first post?
This does have the downside of requiring much more work to create the tables, but admittedly also the upside of not requiring them all to be made up front. Terminus Level's table doesn't need to be made until the party actually heads that far down, for example.
Okay, so here is the grand map of Undermountain. From my understanding, only parts of this ever received full 5' squares maps; Dungeon, Storeroom, Sargauth for the main levels, and some of the random smaller parts.
As an example of the normal maps, here is the first level. Just so that we're all on the same page. This is the stuff that I'm trying to avoid.
Now, say that we use that first map as our basis. We can have three starting points, for current discussion - Yawning Portal, Sewers, Citadel (which is under the Castle, presumably for extra plot fruitiness). The party wants to get to a dungeon, and they have learned that it is on the first level. So we look at our special reference map thingy, and see that they'd pass through two zones - Entrance (whichever one they use), and 1st. Each of these could have specific events tables associated with them, and each require the Guide to make a roll to determine how many events were met, using multiple sub-tables as suggested. If, however, the party want to get to The Maze Level, and they've discovered The Shaft, then they would need to travel through six zones - Entrance, Dungeon, Storeroom, Sargauth, Shaft, Maze. Again, each comes with its (specific?) table of Stuff, including combat encounters, traps, portals (that might act as permanent shortcuts, so that the party can always in the future get from Dungeon to Maze without any intervening steps, for example).
If this was the method taken, I wonder if having discreet roles for party members at all is that helpful. You're already getting beyond the level of abstraction used in AiME or 4e Skill Challenges. Instead, it might be simpler to have "The Party" make a roll of 1d20+proficiency bonus to act as the Guide roll, and then have that prompt a number of events, each of which would be phrased like...
"One party member must make an DC20 Arcana check to decipher the runes on this door, or the party will be forced to return to the previous level and try to find another path."
"Two party members must make Athletics checks at DC10 to help cross a chasm; each failure will give one party member a level of Exhaustion, as they fall and must be retrieved."
Does this sound more... Undermountainy than the abstract method I proposed in the first post?
This does have the downside of requiring much more work to create the tables, but admittedly also the upside of not requiring them all to be made up front. Terminus Level's table doesn't need to be made until the party actually heads that far down, for example.
LordEntrails
Hero
I think a schematic map of the various entrances (there are more than you list) plus the various major points might help. Or might not 
What you might do (though I think you are trying to avoid this) is to have your tables have a chance of a random encounter (maybe a curtain of darkness, a gravity pit, or other UM trap, other NPC's (hostile or not) to help with the flavor.
Can't find my notes, but these are the various known entrances that I can remember;
- Yawning Portal
- Long Dark Stair
- Portal Around the Well / Southfort Portal
- Knight & Shadow (though this is just an entrance to the sewers and then from their into the Dungeon level)
- Sliding alley in Waterdeep that leads into the sewers and then to Grim statue
- A shaft in an alley in Waterdeep that leads to the Grim statue (I think...)
- Skullport, several known portals here for people and ships
- Underdark, numerous tunnels to SkullPort and Spidehaven and elsewhere
For reference, The Forgotten Realms Interactive Atlas mapped the three levels you mention (Dungeon, Storeroom, Sargauth), plus; Crystal Labyrinth, Stardock, Stardock Asteroid, Lost Level, Magddoth's Castle, Wyllowwood, Murial's Gauntlet, Trobriand's Graveyard, 10 levels of Castle Waterdeep, Sewers, Maze.
Halls of Undermoutain (4E) made some changes to the Dungeon level map. But not significant, imo.
Expedition to UM had some new versions of some of those maps plus; Farm Level, Arcuriadoom, Caverns of Ooze, Terminus, Shadowdusk Hold, Mad Wizard's Lair, Skullport (before it was destroyed, plus Schley? did a 5E isometric of Skullport), Spiderhaven, Belkram's Fall (and associated guard post), Citadel, Abbathor's Skeletal Scaffold (in Belkram's Fall), Belkram's Tomb, Umber Hulk Lair. Those are all from Wizrd's website some years back. Might be hard or impossible to find them now.
As far as I know, these are all the publications about UM, most have various versions of the above maps (though some might have unique/new maps!);
Stardock - Undermountain Adventure Trilogy - TSR 9538 - December 1996
The Lost Level - Undermountain Adventure Trilogy - TSR 9516 - May 1996
Maddgoth's Castle - Undermountain Adventure Trilogy - TSR 9528 - August 1996
The Ruins of Undermountain - Campaign Expansion - TSR 1060 - 1991
The Ruins of Undermountain II - Campaign Expansion - TSR 1104 - 1994
City of Splendors - Campaign Expansion - TSR 1109 - August 1994
Waterdeep and the North - Accessory - TSR 9213 - FR1 - 1987
Volo's Guide to Waterdeep - Accessory - TSR 9379 - January 1993
City of Waterdeep Trail Map - TM4 - TSR 9401 - 1989
Skullport - Accesory - TSR 11348 - June 1999
Waterdeep - FRE3 - TSR 9249 - 1989
Waterdeep - Novel - TSR 8474 - 1989
Expedition to Undermountain - Adventure - WotC 957327200 - June 2007 - 3.5E
Halls of Undermountain - Adventure - WotC 38855000 - April 2012 - 4E
The Lost Dragon of Waterdeep - DDI Article - Dragon #414 - 8/22/2012
The Talking Door - DDI Article - Dragon #410 - 4/5/2012
Scoundrels of Skullport - Lords of Waterdeep BG Expedition
Traps of Undermountain - Archive Article - DDI Required - 4/11/2012
What you might do (though I think you are trying to avoid this) is to have your tables have a chance of a random encounter (maybe a curtain of darkness, a gravity pit, or other UM trap, other NPC's (hostile or not) to help with the flavor.
Can't find my notes, but these are the various known entrances that I can remember;
- Yawning Portal
- Long Dark Stair
- Portal Around the Well / Southfort Portal
- Knight & Shadow (though this is just an entrance to the sewers and then from their into the Dungeon level)
- Sliding alley in Waterdeep that leads into the sewers and then to Grim statue
- A shaft in an alley in Waterdeep that leads to the Grim statue (I think...)
- Skullport, several known portals here for people and ships
- Underdark, numerous tunnels to SkullPort and Spidehaven and elsewhere
For reference, The Forgotten Realms Interactive Atlas mapped the three levels you mention (Dungeon, Storeroom, Sargauth), plus; Crystal Labyrinth, Stardock, Stardock Asteroid, Lost Level, Magddoth's Castle, Wyllowwood, Murial's Gauntlet, Trobriand's Graveyard, 10 levels of Castle Waterdeep, Sewers, Maze.
Halls of Undermoutain (4E) made some changes to the Dungeon level map. But not significant, imo.
Expedition to UM had some new versions of some of those maps plus; Farm Level, Arcuriadoom, Caverns of Ooze, Terminus, Shadowdusk Hold, Mad Wizard's Lair, Skullport (before it was destroyed, plus Schley? did a 5E isometric of Skullport), Spiderhaven, Belkram's Fall (and associated guard post), Citadel, Abbathor's Skeletal Scaffold (in Belkram's Fall), Belkram's Tomb, Umber Hulk Lair. Those are all from Wizrd's website some years back. Might be hard or impossible to find them now.
As far as I know, these are all the publications about UM, most have various versions of the above maps (though some might have unique/new maps!);
Stardock - Undermountain Adventure Trilogy - TSR 9538 - December 1996
The Lost Level - Undermountain Adventure Trilogy - TSR 9516 - May 1996
Maddgoth's Castle - Undermountain Adventure Trilogy - TSR 9528 - August 1996
The Ruins of Undermountain - Campaign Expansion - TSR 1060 - 1991
The Ruins of Undermountain II - Campaign Expansion - TSR 1104 - 1994
City of Splendors - Campaign Expansion - TSR 1109 - August 1994
Waterdeep and the North - Accessory - TSR 9213 - FR1 - 1987
Volo's Guide to Waterdeep - Accessory - TSR 9379 - January 1993
City of Waterdeep Trail Map - TM4 - TSR 9401 - 1989
Skullport - Accesory - TSR 11348 - June 1999
Waterdeep - FRE3 - TSR 9249 - 1989
Waterdeep - Novel - TSR 8474 - 1989
Expedition to Undermountain - Adventure - WotC 957327200 - June 2007 - 3.5E
Halls of Undermountain - Adventure - WotC 38855000 - April 2012 - 4E
The Lost Dragon of Waterdeep - DDI Article - Dragon #414 - 8/22/2012
The Talking Door - DDI Article - Dragon #410 - 4/5/2012
Scoundrels of Skullport - Lords of Waterdeep BG Expedition
Traps of Undermountain - Archive Article - DDI Required - 4/11/2012
jimmytheccomic
First Post
What if you sort of broke the map down into "Hub" areas?
So, lets say the first level of Undermountain has four "zones". Library ruins, Ancient Tombs, A Beholder Lair, and a Pirate Den. You'd build each of those as six to seven room mini-dungeons, and then the Skill Challenge you talk about is what the PCs do to get from one Zone to another. And, based on what two zones they're closest to, that would affect the results on the random table?
So, lets say the first level of Undermountain has four "zones". Library ruins, Ancient Tombs, A Beholder Lair, and a Pirate Den. You'd build each of those as six to seven room mini-dungeons, and then the Skill Challenge you talk about is what the PCs do to get from one Zone to another. And, based on what two zones they're closest to, that would affect the results on the random table?
It sounds like people agree on the idea, but not on the very simple tables. I can see that. It's certainly too abstract in my initial version, I'd agree. Something that both [MENTION=20323]Quickleaf[/MENTION] and [MENTION=913]Schmoe[/MENTION] mention is bringing out the flavour more heavily; I wonder if bringing in a very limited element of mapping could help. I'm struggling to think of how to describe this.
Okay, so here is the grand map of Undermountain. From my understanding, only parts of this ever received full 5' squares maps; Dungeon, Storeroom, Sargauth for the main levels, and some of the random smaller parts.
As an example of the normal maps, here is the first level. Just so that we're all on the same page. This is the stuff that I'm trying to avoid.
Now, say that we use that first map as our basis. We can have three starting points, for current discussion - Yawning Portal, Sewers, Citadel (which is under the Castle, presumably for extra plot fruitiness). The party wants to get to a dungeon, and they have learned that it is on the first level. So we look at our special reference map thingy, and see that they'd pass through two zones - Entrance (whichever one they use), and 1st. Each of these could have specific events tables associated with them, and each require the Guide to make a roll to determine how many events were met, using multiple sub-tables as suggested. If, however, the party want to get to The Maze Level, and they've discovered The Shaft, then they would need to travel through six zones - Entrance, Dungeon, Storeroom, Sargauth, Shaft, Maze. Again, each comes with its (specific?) table of Stuff, including combat encounters, traps, portals (that might act as permanent shortcuts, so that the party can always in the future get from Dungeon to Maze without any intervening steps, for example).
If this was the method taken, I wonder if having discreet roles for party members at all is that helpful. You're already getting beyond the level of abstraction used in AiME or 4e Skill Challenges. Instead, it might be simpler to have "The Party" make a roll of 1d20+proficiency bonus to act as the Guide roll, and then have that prompt a number of events, each of which would be phrased like...
"One party member must make an DC20 Arcana check to decipher the runes on this door, or the party will be forced to return to the previous level and try to find another path."
"Two party members must make Athletics checks at DC10 to help cross a chasm; each failure will give one party member a level of Exhaustion, as they fall and must be retrieved."
Does this sound more... Undermountainy than the abstract method I proposed in the first post?
This does have the downside of requiring much more work to create the tables, but admittedly also the upside of not requiring them all to be made up front. Terminus Level's table doesn't need to be made until the party actually heads that far down, for example.
Yeah, that's cool, and it's a lot like what I was thinking of. Traveling through the different zones brings with each its own set of challenges and obstacles, and journeys are differentiated by distance and the path you take. With this you can introduce meaningful choices such as taking the long-way around vs. taking the direct path through a dangerous area. Each zone can be distinguished with particular flavors for events and encounters, and all can be tied together to the overall feel of Undermountain. And the skill checks allow different characters to shine and keep them involved in the success of the journey. I agree that you probably don't need specific roles anymore with this system, as benefits and challenges would be tied more to specific skills. Another nice advantage of this system is that it reinforces the image of Undermountain as an ever-changing labyrinth that defies familiarity and traps even the most experienced delvers. It's a lot harder to do that with a literal map.
Depending on how far you want to take this, you can really expand the system into its own sort of mini-game. The party can find a magical map for a zone that always reduces the number of event rolls when traveling through the zone. There could be a major incursion in another zone that ramps up the danger for a while until some quest is undertaken. You can place permanent portals that allow safe transit from one zone to another. It's really only limited by how much work you want to put into the system and how interesting you and your players find it.
I will say, though, that this definitely has the potential to turn into a fair amount of work. I would only do it if you and your players really want to move away from the literal mapping.
Charles Rampant
Adventurer
I think a schematic map of the various entrances (there are more than you list) plus the various major points might help. Or might not
What you might do (though I think you are trying to avoid this) is to have your tables have a chance of a random encounter (maybe a curtain of darkness, a gravity pit, or other UM trap, other NPC's (hostile or not) to help with the flavor.
Thanks for the list! I've heavily plundered all of the Waterdeep stuff - I basically copy/pasted them into my own wiki and then hyperlinked it all - but Undermountain I've not gone into very deeply, so your list is helpful, even if I abort this method.
As far as combat encounters, I am indeed avoiding them. I'd prefer to have conditions applied that give issues in the actual dungeon they're wanting to explore, rather than just random combats in random hallways. I mean, they have some value - you can toss a really tough fight down, and use stuff that's really leftfield without impacting the flavour of the 'dungeon of the week' (Drow in the random encounter, Undead in the dungeon) - but too often I find myself just wanting to skip them so that we can get on with the actual story.
That's an interesting option, especially since it can help to break down the transit methods between the areas. You can have stuff like... "To unlock access to the Dungeon level, the party must enter this mini-dungeon and defeat it's defenders". It sounds like you'd not have big tables or dungeon level maps, but instead would have really abstract level maps (four big circles on square, essentially) with skill checks to pass between them?
Yes, this is my big concern. Just one d100 table is going to be hours of work, even if I extensively cannibalise random encounter tables from other sources; doing it for 16 levels and transit routes is a tough gig. As you say, it'd really suit the tone of the place, and it would be easy to have really interesting choices come through as a result of different areas having different effects, shortcuts through dangerous areas, even the question of which starting point to use gets texture. But it's a lot of work, which has to be viewed in the context of the other option, which is sucking it up and and just using the extraordinarily huge maps which I can find everywhere. They're so big that I'll never run out of rooms and corridors to use, especially since the nature of the place means that I can add a two-way portal to any random wall and have that be the entrance to my 'dungeon of the week'.
LordEntrails
Hero
I do like the zone idea. But I think you have to have a schematic to go with it. It adds lots of potential (like previously mentioned) and could be adapted to other types of travel as well.
Of course you could use it to access other dungeons (i.e. White Plume, Strahd, etc), but you could also use the same method to abstract the delving part of UM as well and then just have regular dungeon-type adventuring for the key parts of UM you want to play (like Belkram's Fall, Tobriand's Graveyard, etc).
Do let us know what you decide on
EDIT: Oh, and glad you found some of that info helpful, I was concerned about posting a big wall of text like that!
Of course you could use it to access other dungeons (i.e. White Plume, Strahd, etc), but you could also use the same method to abstract the delving part of UM as well and then just have regular dungeon-type adventuring for the key parts of UM you want to play (like Belkram's Fall, Tobriand's Graveyard, etc).
Do let us know what you decide on
EDIT: Oh, and glad you found some of that info helpful, I was concerned about posting a big wall of text like that!
I've been searching for something similar. Making the in between travel meaningful. I just did a travel session, and aside from a little story, it didn't effect anything. Single encounter days and going nova are dull in my eyes. Let's get there I say!
I've been really interested in AiME's overland travel, but was underwhelmed when I glanced through it. I really like the way you first layed it out, really liked the exhaustion stays until you leave (meaning get to where you are going). I made some travel tables, but they were more like non-combat encounters and took up over an hour for 3 of them. Other times I have put simple scenes in for flavor with a non-challenge just to add immersion.
But, none of it really feels meaningful, so I'm looking forward to seeing this develop. Hell I'll even help out with the d100 tables!
I've been really interested in AiME's overland travel, but was underwhelmed when I glanced through it. I really like the way you first layed it out, really liked the exhaustion stays until you leave (meaning get to where you are going). I made some travel tables, but they were more like non-combat encounters and took up over an hour for 3 of them. Other times I have put simple scenes in for flavor with a non-challenge just to add immersion.
But, none of it really feels meaningful, so I'm looking forward to seeing this develop. Hell I'll even help out with the d100 tables!
Ilbranteloth
Explorer
I think it's quite workable, although I'd do things a bit differently.
To start, I don't restrict players from reading source material. Since I don't run published adventures, the plot and specifics don't generally matter to me. Instead, I love the better immersion that a shared known world provides. The players can talk about things that they all can learn and reference. When one player says that they should meet at Pharra's Alley in Waterdeep, the others might know something about it, or they can check it out in Volo's Guide, or whatever. They know that things won't be exactly as published anyway, although it often bears some resemblance to the "truth" in our campaign.
Maps are the same way. For something as huge as Undermountain, just copy the maps, and cut them into pieces, using only the chunks you want. Then you connect them however you'd like. Your "Journey" approach seems like it would work fine for these in between portions, providing a sort of summary system for what's happening between major scenes.
This approach for the maps has been around a long time. Think of D1-2 Descent into the Depths of the Earth, or ICE's MERP supplements Moria or Erech and the Paths of the Dead where important points are detailed, and the spaces between are only loosely mapped, with lots of room to add whatever you need to.
When the Journey indicates an encounter, you can pull out any piece of the map that you aren't otherwise using. The random dungeon generator in the DMG (or the old one in the AD&D DMG) can also be used when you're at a point where they need to look around a bit.
In fact, I'd recommend dropping out of Journey mode every once in a while for exploration that isn't that important as well. Part of the point of a dungeon crawl, and especially a mega-dungeon, is the exploration itself. And sometimes there are empty rooms, or things of little value to the existing story, but that can still have an impact.
The design of Undermountain itself was made with lots of one-way portals to avoid the need for just linear mapping. You suddenly find yourself "here" and need to figure out where "here" is.
For portions that they travel normally, but the Journey approach is taken, just connect the sections with a line. You can indicate other passages they didn't take by numbers (there were 12 to the right, and 7 to the left, or whatever). The assumption is that they mapped the regions between and can follow that to get back out.
For the Journey rules themselves, if I were to use them I've recommended some changes in another thread, and I think they'd work well for you:
I'd be careful of effects that last "until you leave Undermountain." Because of a real possibility of getting lost (especially after a single one-way portal), that's probably a bit too much.
But I do think that the mechanical effects should be more than just exhaustion. Things like expending Hit Dice, short and/or long rest abilities, spell slots, etc. to represent the use of resources while exploring. This should also include things like food, water, light sources, etc., although those have often become trivial at this point.
But essentially:
1. Open it up for the party to participate, rather than trying to shoe-horn people into artificial and unnecessary roles.
2. The actions of the PCs leading to the embarkation roll can have an impact on the embarkation roll.
3. The embarkation roll should have an impact on the event rolls.
4. Each event should "pull the party out of the journey" to let them act.
Now that I think about it, I'd probably combine the purpose of the Journey Event and Arrival tables altogether. Especially when using the system for something like Undermountain. Each time they encounter an event, they will also have utilized some resources based on the roll.
The main reason I like this approach, especially in a Dungeon, is that it puts the engagement of the Journey rules into the hands of the players, at least partially. In other words, they are the ones that are choosing to zoom in or out on the action. In either case, they'll be utilizing resources and developing the story. What they won't be utilizing is the resource of real-world time.
"This area looks interesting, we're going to explore a bit" vs "OK, we've dealt with that, but this isn't our goal, so we'll keep moving."
Actually, the more I think about it, this is really about a more sophisticated random encounter approach. Where the roll for the encounter/event also incorporates the activities leading up to the event and addresses the passage of time in a way that isn't handled via the rules very well.
The Embarkation roll is modified by the preparation of the PCs, including the quality and quantity of their information. That roll, in turn, has an impact on what encounter/event occurs, including how dangerous it is, what resources they have expended at the point of the event, and even potentially how much time has passed between the events.
I'm going to work on fleshing this out for what I'm working on, where the PCs are hired for a hunting expedition. I expect the first few days to be pure exploration, searching for signs of their quarry, and returning to town each night. Once they locate a trail, then they will be setting up camp in the wild, but it will probably still take several days to find what they're looking for.
To start, I don't restrict players from reading source material. Since I don't run published adventures, the plot and specifics don't generally matter to me. Instead, I love the better immersion that a shared known world provides. The players can talk about things that they all can learn and reference. When one player says that they should meet at Pharra's Alley in Waterdeep, the others might know something about it, or they can check it out in Volo's Guide, or whatever. They know that things won't be exactly as published anyway, although it often bears some resemblance to the "truth" in our campaign.
Maps are the same way. For something as huge as Undermountain, just copy the maps, and cut them into pieces, using only the chunks you want. Then you connect them however you'd like. Your "Journey" approach seems like it would work fine for these in between portions, providing a sort of summary system for what's happening between major scenes.
This approach for the maps has been around a long time. Think of D1-2 Descent into the Depths of the Earth, or ICE's MERP supplements Moria or Erech and the Paths of the Dead where important points are detailed, and the spaces between are only loosely mapped, with lots of room to add whatever you need to.
When the Journey indicates an encounter, you can pull out any piece of the map that you aren't otherwise using. The random dungeon generator in the DMG (or the old one in the AD&D DMG) can also be used when you're at a point where they need to look around a bit.
In fact, I'd recommend dropping out of Journey mode every once in a while for exploration that isn't that important as well. Part of the point of a dungeon crawl, and especially a mega-dungeon, is the exploration itself. And sometimes there are empty rooms, or things of little value to the existing story, but that can still have an impact.
The design of Undermountain itself was made with lots of one-way portals to avoid the need for just linear mapping. You suddenly find yourself "here" and need to figure out where "here" is.
For portions that they travel normally, but the Journey approach is taken, just connect the sections with a line. You can indicate other passages they didn't take by numbers (there were 12 to the right, and 7 to the left, or whatever). The assumption is that they mapped the regions between and can follow that to get back out.
For the Journey rules themselves, if I were to use them I've recommended some changes in another thread, and I think they'd work well for you:
I'd be careful of effects that last "until you leave Undermountain." Because of a real possibility of getting lost (especially after a single one-way portal), that's probably a bit too much.
But I do think that the mechanical effects should be more than just exhaustion. Things like expending Hit Dice, short and/or long rest abilities, spell slots, etc. to represent the use of resources while exploring. This should also include things like food, water, light sources, etc., although those have often become trivial at this point.
But essentially:
1. Open it up for the party to participate, rather than trying to shoe-horn people into artificial and unnecessary roles.
2. The actions of the PCs leading to the embarkation roll can have an impact on the embarkation roll.
3. The embarkation roll should have an impact on the event rolls.
4. Each event should "pull the party out of the journey" to let them act.
Now that I think about it, I'd probably combine the purpose of the Journey Event and Arrival tables altogether. Especially when using the system for something like Undermountain. Each time they encounter an event, they will also have utilized some resources based on the roll.
The main reason I like this approach, especially in a Dungeon, is that it puts the engagement of the Journey rules into the hands of the players, at least partially. In other words, they are the ones that are choosing to zoom in or out on the action. In either case, they'll be utilizing resources and developing the story. What they won't be utilizing is the resource of real-world time.
"This area looks interesting, we're going to explore a bit" vs "OK, we've dealt with that, but this isn't our goal, so we'll keep moving."
Actually, the more I think about it, this is really about a more sophisticated random encounter approach. Where the roll for the encounter/event also incorporates the activities leading up to the event and addresses the passage of time in a way that isn't handled via the rules very well.
The Embarkation roll is modified by the preparation of the PCs, including the quality and quantity of their information. That roll, in turn, has an impact on what encounter/event occurs, including how dangerous it is, what resources they have expended at the point of the event, and even potentially how much time has passed between the events.
I'm going to work on fleshing this out for what I'm working on, where the PCs are hired for a hunting expedition. I expect the first few days to be pure exploration, searching for signs of their quarry, and returning to town each night. Once they locate a trail, then they will be setting up camp in the wild, but it will probably still take several days to find what they're looking for.
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