D&D 5E (OPTIMIZATION) THE NAMELESS KING ! THE WIZARD's NIGHTMARE! LAST BOSS

[FrogReaver]

No, illusions doesn't use spells slots.
Darkness or Invisibility/pass without trace is the only true cost.
Wrong wrong, It's army of undeads.

Illusions now use no spell slots????
you never answered how many undead.

 

[mgshamster]

Re: Animate Undead.

It's not 5 per casting, it's 8 per casting as a 5th level slot. You start with 4 and get 2 more for each spell level above 3rd. You're using 5th level spell, so 4+2+2=8. If your simulacrum also casts it, then it's 16.

However, you cannot keep casting it over and over. The undead are under your control for 24 hours, and if you recast it, you regain control for an additional 24 hours. You do not get more undead. So you have, at most, 16 undead using 5th level slots between you and your sim. You can use a higher level slot if you want, but as those are limited, that caps them at 24 hours (after that they are uncontrollable and may attack you and your sim; not like they'd be a threat to you) OR it caps your most recent long rest at 24 hours ago.

 

[FrogReaver]

Re: Animate Undead.

It's not 5 per casting, it's 8 per casting as a 5th level slot. You start with 4 and get 2 more for each spell level above 3rd. You're using 5th level spell, so 4+2+2=8. If your simulacrum also casts it, then it's 16.

However, you cannot keep casting it over and over. The undead are under your control for 24 hours, and if you recast it, you regain control for an additional 24 hours. You do not get more undead. So you have, at most, 16 undead using 5th level slots between you and your sim. You can use a higher level slot if you want, but as those are limited, that caps them at 24 hours (after that they are uncontrollable and may attack you and your sim; not like they'd be a threat to you) OR it caps your most recent long rest at 24 hours ago.

Even 16 undead is hardly an army...

 

[Vaen0811]

Interesting challenge.

What happens If Locate Object is used to locate NK’s amulet? NK is immune to divination because of amulet but doesn’t specify if the amulet itself cannot be divined.

 

[pukunui]

Well, that was fun while it lasted ... Now what? Do we just talk amongst ourselves?

 

[Ovinomancer]

Divination doesn't work against Illusions and True Seeing is only 120'

Illusions are visible to remote viewing divination spells, your villain isn't. If I scry an area with an illusion, I will see the illusion. If I scry an area with your villain, I will not see him.

So, yeah, they do work exactly as I said they do.

The funny thing about their claims is that they killed my simulacrum, ignored the Illusions, went 4 simultaneous meteor swarm to try to reduce HP to 0, killed all the undeads. As if they could notice the villain (But, they can't) and still distinguish him as a real target.

How do we not notice him? He's not invisible all the time, he's not hiding all the time, he has to be near this army of undead and his simulacrum, and, with the rate at which he has to rest to do things like preparing all of his illusions, he has to be near his base of operations so he can keep resting. Locating the general area your villain is in is trivial.

Further, if he's actually trying to be impossible to find, he could do a good job of it, but then he's not actually a threat to anything because he's so busy hiding.

Detail: A simple subtle spell destroys the entire group, they are easy targets for Undeads and Illusions it will be funny to watch them spend their spells on them. Hahahahaha

Which one? Because most of the spells you're thinking of mean the villain is quite close to the party, and assume that the party is dumb and has no countermeasures for these things. You keep saying your villain has indistinguishable illusions that hide his real location, but yet the party of 4 wizards cannot do a similar thing -- even better because each can create illusions of the entire party and only have to worry about maintaining one at a time.

But, I think they're pretty easy to fool and with indirect fighting they're crying kids.

Yet every time you've actually tried to explain how this works it's been shown you can't do it with all your necessary protections up. For instance, if the villain is sneaking up to harass the party, he's got 1 minute of greater invisibility to do it in. He can't have sanctuary up, as he'll be maintaining his single casting of Pw/oT. If he has his staff up, he's immediately noticed as the cloud of insects. If he's sending in an illusion to distract, paying attention to the illusion to see if it actually adjusts to party actions will reveal if the villain is in range to control it, at which point we have a CEP (circular error probability) of less than 120' for our 1 mile diameter counterstrike. Pretty much any tactic that requires the villain to close to the point he can attempt to annoy the party with directly cast spells put the villain at severe risk of being detected with most of his defenses off. That's a death sentence.

Well, to defeat them easily is just to end their timing and make them spend their resources or just subtle sugestion, command, enemies abound, others.

Sure, you could wait them out, but that hurts the villain more because he's maintaining so many things that require constant casting using slots that can't benefit from spell points. Once you burn those slots to counter the party actions long enough to wait out their durations, you can't do it again. The party has 4 wizards that can rotate high level spell castings far more readily than the villain can, even with the simulacrum. And burning out the simulacrum for the villain is a yearlong rest cycle to replace -- the party wins the waiting game.

So, the best bet for the villain is a full frontal assault -- to overwhelm the party before they can waste his resources. And, given the action economy, is still a losing bet for the villain.

A single: Wish: Meteor Swarm Immunity (But, It isn't needed) can cause serious problems for them, not only that, Shield Mastery feat simply nullifies all damage. (Now you need a minimum of 5 Meteor Swarm). Extremely efficient against unsynchronized attacks.

And risk burning out your Wish? You're becoming desperate. Also easily countered by: Wish: the Villain has Meteor Swarm vulnerability. Now we only need 2.

Shield mastery feat? Which feat are you dumping for this?

If losing a single meteor swarm is no longer enough to kill him (ignoring all defenses already listed, after clone or Revify they wastes all meteor swarms )

Who's casting clone or revivify? The simulacrum dies in the meteor swarm.

They have a great chance to use 6 swarm meteor and still do not kill the villain, it would be hilarious.

Don't need to. Now that you've listened to our tactics discussion and are prepared for (and possibly burned out your wish to protect against) our false meteor swarm attack, we can go with the actual plan that totally isn't that. Heck, we aren't even really 4 wizards, but instead a group of amorphous characters that can swap levels and powers freely at a whim, so we all stocked up on coffeelocks and simulacrums but now were monks and barbarians dipping bard with wings of flying, gems of true seeing, scrolls of (countering whatever the villain does as a bonus action) x 10, and rings of wishing villains dead, no save, no range, no resurrection magic allowed, and totally no cloning.

Sure, it's a lot of effort, but if we just keep changing our plans and making legendary items at a whim and ignoring the rules, we'll totally smoke this King guy.

 

[MisterWhisper]

Nevermind, not worth it.

 

[pukunui]

[MENTION=16814]Ovinomancer[/MENTION]: There's not much point in continuing to ask the OP questions. He's been banned from his own thread.

 

[FrogReaver]

[MENTION=16814]Ovinomancer[/MENTION]: There's not much point in continuing to ask the OP questions. He's been banned from his own thread.

I find it entertaining to counter his points even if he can't attempt a reply. Tough break for him I guess.

 

[pukunui]

Fair enough.