Why are you acting like ability scores and the paint by number pregenerated ideals,flaws and bonds are anything alike? Backgrounds are very malleable, don't like the options make up your own, don't want to use them at all? That's fine to. Want to use premade backgrounds but put your own ideals and flaws in? Sure go ahead.
Stats are not like that. You roll,assign and then role-play and the rest with what they are.
What's the real difference between choosing your own flaw and where you put your one 8? Or your 11, if you're using point buy and choose to stay average? Or your one 16, because your table uses roll 8d6 keep highest and assign to taste? Your argument here is that traits are malleable and stats aren't, but stats are just as malleable as traits, you're just choosing to ignore that.
It looks a lot like your trolling.
I assure you I am not. Coming face to face with honestly held different beliefs can look like that if you're unwilling to step back and actually consider where it's coming from. I recommend playing in a few sessions of any of the Powered by the Apocolypse games and seeing that there are, indeed, very different styles of play than your own. Perhaps then you'd consider that someone might have a rational, fully formed, and coherent style of play that isn't yours and doesn't lionize the same things your style does. I don't fetishize stats. I'm not to the point of [MENTION=6801328]Elfcrusher[/MENTION], though, in that I think that playing a 5 INT Sherlock Holmes is farcical because that character cannot actually perform in game according to archetype, but that's my dislike of farce in game, not a hard rule on what a 5 INT represents. I've no problem playing a 5 INT as not a drooling moron, because I don't think it represents that, either.
At this point are you actually trying to get him to see your side? Do you think your going to change anything?
Yes. Maybe? I'm asking the question because it seems like there's a contradiction in the statements and I'd curious as to what causes it. Maybe it'll make him change his mind, or maybe it'll provide a new avenue for discussion, or maybe it won't. If I don't ask, only the latter is sure to obtain.
What he does at his table isn't going to effect you and I think this thread has done a lot to show that both sides are right,neither side 100% but enough that we can understand that yeah people are viewing things differently and that's ok. Neither side is engaging in bad or hurtful game play, it's just a difference of opinion in a rpg that aims to have much of it left up to the players and DM.
Oh, goodness, someone has forgotten their on a discussion forum. Of course it won't affect my table -- or will it? Because, in that 3 year old thread that was linked a few pages ago about NPCs using skills against PCs,
I was on your side of the argument. Go read it, you'll see. I made a lot of the same arguments you and [MENTION=6688937]Ratskinner[/MENTION] are making (and [MENTION=6803664]ccs[/MENTION]). But, starting in that thread, and in a few more where I got mad at [MENTION=97077]iserith[/MENTION] (I've accused him of trolling, too, much to my future embarrassment), I started looking at how I run games, what I was doing, and realized that a lot of my dissatisfaction was how I was running -- what luggage I was bringing with me. I've changed my style since then, sought out a few good non-D&D games to sample different concepts altogether, and fashioned a different playstyle that's much more [MENTION=97077]iserith[/MENTION] and [MENTION=6776133]Bawylie[/MENTION] that my old one.
So, yeah, maybe this is the start of a change and maybe it isn't, but whether or not it affects my table right now, this is still a discussion forum where we talk about pretending to be elves.
I think sometimes we get so caught up in the argument that we forget that we are all on the same side. We love rpg's! There are few enough of us out there lets agree to disagree and still hold each other in a positive light.
You told us what you would do, how you feel about it and why. That's cool man, I would have no issue with playing in that game. That doesn't mean I agree, just that eh it's not that big a thing. When I'm a player I'm more than willing to twist my likes and dislikes to whatever the poor smuck who I conned into doing all the work and letting me play in his game want!
I can role play in any game. Enjoy any (healthy) play-style. I had to say Healthy as I once joined a Vampire The Masquerade game that ended up being WAY more S&M than I was comfortable with lol. Though even then...I guess if THEY were having a blast who am I to say it was wrong?
Peace, my man.
Kumbaya, dude.