D&D 5E Limited Wish - Money Maker?
NaturalZero
Hero
Sure, I have a feeling there's probably some named principle saying that having less to work with breeds creativity.
In the context of DnD spellcasting though, having spells and combinations of spells allows you to come up with things you really couldn't have come up with otherwise. In a previous edition, I saw someone try to drop a whale on someone but couldn't summon one without body of water. They used some kind of force field spell and a another one that summoned a large amount of water. This set up the situation for summoning the whale and when they dismissed the force field effect, they were able to drop the whale on top a powerful enemy for a one-shot. This kind of play is super creative and pretty much impossible without have a big tool box to work from. I can guarantee you that most people on this board can tell you stories about games where people came up with inventive spell uses... but all of that is made possible by access to the tools in the first place.
You CAN make a wonderfully creative monochromatic paintings but that doesn't mean that you can't be at least as inventive by using the whole palette.
aco175
Legend
I recall some other discussions on these boards about making arrows or continual flame to break the economy. I would vote to cure disease or lessor restoration. Granted you will get mostly poor people that cannot be cured already, but it would be a great hook for the campaign with all the infirm following you around or the cult of disease trying to off you.
Li Shenron
Legend
I disagree. A giant toolbox makes you look into it to find the ready-made tool for every job; it IS the hammer that solves every problem!
If you're stuck with Eyebite, it encourages you to solve your problems without magic, and also have someone else in the party doing it instead of just asking the Wizard.
Having a huge toolbox and warping that huge toolbox to solve problems that it was never intended to is equally creative.
Creativity is easier with a smaller toolbox; I mean, if you can only do one thing, you don't have to think about 50 options and how they interact with each other. Creativity with a huge toolbox can get so hard you give up on it.
Creativity is easier with a smaller toolbox; I mean, if you can only do one thing, you don't have to think about 50 options and how they interact with each other. Creativity with a huge toolbox can get so hard you give up on it.
Kurotowa
Legend
There can be satisfaction in both extremes.
Sometimes you've been lugging around a highly specialized tool for five levels just waiting for the moment when you need exactly that tool for a problem. When that moment finally comes it feels good, because it justifies your foresight to have prepared that tool and your determination to have kept it around all this time. Sometimes you're throw against a challenge you never expected and all you've got is two socket wrenches, a hammer, a bent nail, and half a spool of string. When you find a way to combine those into an unexpected solution to your problem it feels good, because you've applied your imagination to overcome a challenge under difficult circumstances.
When you slip away from those two poles is when things get less satisfying. If you have a multi-tool that can respond to any situation, so that no preparation is required. If you have a tool that's so powerful you can use it to fix every problem, just through brute force. Then there's no validation, no challenge, and no fun.
Does that describe Limited Wish? Well... not exactly. Limited Wish is limited. You get exactly one use and then it's on cooldown for up to several days at once. So there's creativity in making that single spell count and you can't throw it at every problem you come across. Also, let's be fair, it's a 14th Level ability. By that level you should be facing challenges that can't be trivialized by a single 6th Level or lower spell, no matter how specialized.
NaturalZero
Hero
Having tools that are fewer in number but much greater in flexibility is certainly fun.
I feel like I mention it in every thread, but I've recently realized how great Wall of Stone is just because it's permanent and the text says it can take any shape you want. One spell, infinite variation. Of course, as a warlock the only reason I had access to it was because i had the option to get a larger toolbox.
I've had characters in 3.5 with access to huge swathes of abilities that could change per encounter or per day and it was pretty satisfying discovering novel interactions of buffs or forms to take. It wasn't even about carrying a spell around for levels waiting to use it or finding a new way to use a hammer. It was a satisfying and engaging process poring over books in order to construct the perfect combo that no one you'd seen had come up with.
Kurotowa
Legend
That is indeed another form of creativity. It's something I've enjoyed indulging in too. But we have to admit that it isn't for everyone. Lots of people just get overwhelmed if you're throwing multiple books at them and asking them to cross-reference material and sift through a mountain of permutations to try and find novel or optimal ones.
I've got a player in my group who's working six days a week, on top of a wife and a 1yo baby, and they barely have time to sit down to play. Asking them to devote extra hours outside of game time is just not possible. I've got a player in my group who's there for the socialization not the tactical engagement. They recently retired a Cleric in favor of a Fighter because they were having zero fun trying to juggle all their spell options in combat.
So what I'm saying is, none of us should mistake our own path to satisfaction for a universal thing. What makes D&D 5e our game of choice over PF 2e or 13th Age is that it does have the Champion Fighter for the guy who really just wants to make two attacks per round and nothing else. That range of character complexity is a major selling point.
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