D&D 5E How should be the future Oriental Adventures.

[ZeshinX]

As I mentioned earlier when I did my multi-book "Asian Adventures" pitch - bringing more people of different cultural backgrounds onboard in positions of leadership and authority for the writing of setting material that takes inspiration from their cultural background can only be a net positive, because their knowledge and background will allow the book to avoid pitfalls that an author from outside that culture will miss, and just as importantly, will be able to guide the book to incorporate material that an author from outside that culture wouldn't know that it existed. That is a net gain.

I understand the intent there, definitely, and see quite a lot of good can and will come from it. It's where that could go...not will go, just could go. I'm just not at the point of seeing the net positive, as you describe (short term positive definitely...long term, not so much). I think only time can ultimately tell of course, so we'll see...but there's a lot of parallels to the past that I'm just not able to ignore and the feeling it leaves me with is one of significant unease.

However, that unease is my thing to deal with and not someone else.

 

[DammitVictor]

Similarly, they also did the Dragon Fist RPG around the time of the transition between AD&D 2nd edition and D&D 3rd edition. If they still have the rights to that setting, I think bringing some Chinese American writers in and reworking the setting for 5th edition would be a good idea.

They don't have the rights anymore-- they sold the rights to Green Ronin shortly after Chris Pramas (the original author) founded the company. Green Ronin has always wanted to do a proper d20 version dating all the way back to 2003, but for some reason or another it's always been delayed. I'm really hoping they finally get around to it, but I'm really hoping it's not based on 5e.

It's not really an impediment to WotC either creating a new setting or basing a new wuxia game on any of their pre-existing Chinese-influenced properties.

There should be little to no effort aimed at putting D&D the tabletop RPG in Asia, it's not where the market is or could be worked with. The best thing they could try is a novel or two, or one of the video games which was a lot of resources for localization.

I think that's nonsense. The localization of BECMI in Japan was one of the most successul (and unique) localizations in the history of the industry-- and I really don't think there's any financial reason or cultural that success couldn't be duplicated with modern D&D. Count Zero's (excellent) breakdown of why nobody should do business with China aside, the Japanese and South Korean markets are practically perfect for the RPG industry, and Asia's a whole lot bigger than the countries imitated in Oriental Adventures.

I know a lot of Filipino gamers, for instance.

It's like trying to get D&D to the (Sub-Saharan) African market (not counting South Africa which probably has a mostly Afrikaner player base) while ignoring Black D&D players in North America, who actually are more likely to play tabletop D&D then those on the continent.

If a country can support a thriving Heavy Metal scene, they can support a D&D fandom. WotC would be fools to ignore either potential market.

 

[Chaosmancer]

I don't know that limiting these things is the best course. I'm not even certain that is what's happening to be honest, but it sure seems like it. I just can't help but wonder, "When did we surrender our responsibility for our feelings to others?"

A lot of great thoughts in your post, a lot of them that I agree with, but this question inspired me to pull it out and expand on it.

I actually don't remember what the series was called, but I was substituting in a classroom and they had three small children's books on bullying. It was the same story, written from the perspective of the Bully, the Victim, and a bystander.

Each part showed their experience, their problems, and offered an acronym solution for reaching an understanding.


I bring this up, because your question and other assertions like it keep trying to make this an either/or problem. To illustrate with a bullying example, if someone walks into a room points at a table and says "Hey, fat ugly slob, what slop are you eating?" what is going on?

Your question about the "responsibility for our feelings" indicates that the entire weight of the issue, whether or not it is harmful or wrong, is on the victim. They must choose how they feel and accept this and what they do about it. And, to a degree, you are right. They have to figure out how they will react and deal with that.

But the bully has some responsibility too right? After all, they are the instigator. If they weren't instigating, then the situation wouldn't happen.

But, even beyond that, the bystanders have a responsibility here as well. Do they laugh and side with the bully? Do they stay silent, heads down, and hope they don't get noticed? Do they stand with the victim?

I grant, this is real life, and a much more nuanced and complicated issue. If everything were as simple as cafeteria insults the world would be a much better and easier place. But, to be clear, we are in general the bystanders. And we need to choose our actions and how we will go forward.

Telling the victim to not let the bully define them is one approach. But telling them to choose not to be affected is a lot harder. And saying that this wouldn't even be an issue if they weren't so sensitive.... is just bullying again.

So, yes, everyone has their own responsibility in this situation. Including us.

 

[Tonguez]

Xaolin Showdown was created by a first-generation Chinese immigrant, Christy Hui. Also, it only lasted a single season from what I can tell attempts to do follow-up series have failed. That could be due to complaints about cultural insensitivity with some of the episodes that Hui had less involvement with, or it could be other issues - I can't find clear information at this time

Xaolin Showdown got 3 seasons but then WB Animation made budget cuts to everything and Showdown was shuffled out. It also got a PlayStation game

Christy Hu then shifted production to Canada with a change to Xaolin Chronicles which wasn’t as good and had to change voice actors, animation style and story details because WB stIll own the rights

 

[ZeshinX]

A lot of great thoughts in your post, a lot of them that I agree with, but this question inspired me to pull it out and expand on it.

I actually don't remember what the series was called, but I was substituting in a classroom and they had three small children's books on bullying. It was the same story, written from the perspective of the Bully, the Victim, and a bystander.

Each part showed their experience, their problems, and offered an acronym solution for reaching an understanding.


I bring this up, because your question and other assertions like it keep trying to make this an either/or problem. To illustrate with a bullying example, if someone walks into a room points at a table and says "Hey, fat ugly slob, what slop are you eating?" what is going on?

Your question about the "responsibility for our feelings" indicates that the entire weight of the issue, whether or not it is harmful or wrong, is on the victim. They must choose how they feel and accept this and what they do about it. And, to a degree, you are right. They have to figure out how they will react and deal with that.

But the bully has some responsibility too right? After all, they are the instigator. If they weren't instigating, then the situation wouldn't happen.

But, even beyond that, the bystanders have a responsibility here as well. Do they laugh and side with the bully? Do they stay silent, heads down, and hope they don't get noticed? Do they stand with the victim?

I grant, this is real life, and a much more nuanced and complicated issue. If everything were as simple as cafeteria insults the world would be a much better and easier place. But, to be clear, we are in general the bystanders. And we need to choose our actions and how we will go forward.

Telling the victim to not let the bully define them is one approach. But telling them to choose not to be affected is a lot harder. And saying that this wouldn't even be an issue if they weren't so sensitive.... is just bullying again.

So, yes, everyone has their own responsibility in this situation. Including us.

It's in this general state where my mind currently resides. Trying to look at things from as many perspectives as my mind allows me to, be they self-generated, the perspectives of those here and from other places. There's obviously a great deal of speculation that occurs as well, based on various perspectives (which no doubt lose something in translation from here to my mind and heart...even the self-generated ones in a weird way)...the speculation leads to various endpoints of varying degrees, be they extreme left, right and the vast in-between.

I do very much try to avoid situations of "This vs. That" in discussions of this sort, as I find they tend to lose the element of nuance and complexity...but at times it's a useful exercise, as it can (not always) help introduce oft-needed clarity when the nuance/complexity becomes enormously difficult to sort through. It's a laborious process to be sure, but generally a rewarding one in the end. There are risks as well, as the intent or goal can often get lost in the mix.

I've found (rightly, wrongly, in a box by the door) intent is often an element that is regularly dismissed as ultimately irrelevant. I find it difficult to dismiss it so easily, as I think it very much does matter, as it can, in many ways, play an enormous part in the understanding of a situation. I don't argue that intent can do anything to change the immediate emotional context of a consequence to an individual or group...but it does have a major role to play in understanding how we got here, and where we go from here. Dismissing it in the moment feels like a wonderful idea, but the larger picture demands its presence, and losing it will, I suspect, lead to what amounts to an impassable lack of understanding.

I would very much like to see more OA content in the future. It's own tome, various drips and drops in future products, what have you. My desire is to see such content continue, vetted to avoid "-ists" and "-isms" yes, but not lacking in imaginative scope or overly weighted with concerns over upsetting any culture, as the intent is not to represent said cultures, merely to let the imagination fly freely and to be inspired by it.

Great discussions all around though, and I am glad to be a part of them.

 

[LuisCarlos17f]

Stereotypes in fictional worlds aren't a crime. Who worries about dwarfs as little Germans and elves like thin Frenchs?

I have said some times the future of the TTRPG franchises could be linked with the videogame industry. Some future videogames not only will allow to create, and share, your own adventure/missions/quests, but also (interactive) comics and machinima movies. And who would use them? Streamers to earn money in youtube. And manga also will be changed. For example a mangaka only will draw some sketch, and the classic comic-book inking will be replaced with special software what transformr those sketches into CGI, or even hyperealist pictures. Some streamers will be groups of TTRPG players using software videogames as virtual tabletops, and we wouldn't see the faces of the players, but listening their voices, and looking the slips movines when these speak. Don't you think D&D would sell more with regional version of game-live shows? for example young people who aim for become seiyū (voice actors)

I guess we agree about to be respectful, and Hasbro/WotC is the first one who wants a good relation with the different Asian markets, to earn money with possible new franchises. I am not talking about Western creating wuxia for Asian market, but I ask about how to give the right tools for the Asian authors could create Wuxia D&D for the Western fandom. How could we help xuanhuan authors to create D&D adventures for Asian and Wester fandom?

Chinese Webnovel Categories

A list of genres/categories on 17k, which is one of the largest Chinese webnovel sites aside from Qidian and Zongheng. Translated by Epithetic Translated from the outline provided on 17K’s news blo…

immortalmountain.wordpress.com

Hasbro could work with Asian companies for co-productions, but you can bet it will want total controll over its those just created IPs. At least should allow those PC races, monster and classes to be open licence to be added into the SRD.

* If the ikesai (different world) genre is popular there is a possible way to allow this in D&D. Two worlds are linked. One would be more fantasy gaslight, XIX century, and people from here sometimes are sent, or reincarnated, into a different world, more like the feudal age, without neither firearms and modern tech. (Now I am following the manwah Lady Baby. Do you advice me another?). Ravenloft may be ikesai in its own way when the PCs are abducted from other worlds to suffer their weekend in the hell.

Chuanyue - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

* Now I am thinking about a new PC race based in the mecha-musume (mecanic girl), an inanimated magic object, (usually a weapon) who become setients and then can change the shape into a cute girl.

Moe Anthropomorphism - TV Tropes

 

[Kaodi]

Off the top of my head I cannot think of any two syllable words starting with "D" that would neatly evoke an Asian setting. If you could fine one creating a variant on the name Dungeons & Dragons could be the way to go. Obviously Asia has their own dragons - dungeon could be replaced.

I suppose you could just call a book by the setting name but that seems restrictive in a way. D&D still uses an implied rather than explicit setting, does it not? I play Pathfinder these days and they are in a slightly different boat with Lost Omens.

 

[WayOfTheFourElements]

I think WotC should continue selling the original OA, but mention in the blurb that the continued publication for OA is primarily for historicity . WotC should then point out and link to renditions similar worlds and adventures written with more cultural awareness.

 

[WayOfTheFourElements]

Off the top of my head I cannot think of any two syllable words starting with "D" that would neatly evoke an Asian setting. If you could fine one creating a variant on the name Dungeons & Dragons could be the way to go. Obviously Asia has their own dragons - dungeon could be replaced.

I suppose you could just call a book by the setting name but that seems restrictive in a way. D&D still uses an implied rather than explicit setting, does it not? I play Pathfinder these days and they are in a slightly different boat with Lost Omens.

Don't say that. They might publish Koreans and Katanas.

 

[DammitVictor]

Off the top of my head I cannot think of any two syllable words starting with "D" that would neatly evoke an Asian setting.

There are international polylingual marketing professionals for whom this is their entire job.