D&D General What is the appeal of Tolkien fantasy races?

[embee]

I'll admit I'm a new school D&D player/DM. I've never discounted a player idea in osr or 5e, but I still wonder. Dwarves, elves, halflings... and so on.

Why do people chose these races?

To me, elves and dwarves are just humans with some tokrm magic element. Turtle people, and cat people and demon people and dragon people seem like a fun experience. Why playa dwarf and not a mountain dwelling human miner? Why wood elves and not tribal forest dwelling humans? Wealthy human wizards instead of high elves? I mean are humans even relevant in D&D anymore?

Is it a role-playing thing, or just a ability bonus power-up thing? I don't think I've ever ran a group that had a single human in it.

Tolkien has enjoyed enormous popularity for a half-century now.

Consider this: Led Zeppelin, the greatest rock band of all-time (pipe down, grognards! Zepp is better than the Beatles and that's just the gods' honest truth), peppered their lyrics with Tolkien references. Battle of Evermore, Ramble On, Misty Mountain Hop, Over The Hills And Far Away, and arguably "Stairway To Heaven" all contain references. The gatefold of Led Zeppelin IV features Gandalf and his quote "Not all those who wander are lost." At the same time, prog-rockers Rush put out "The Necromancer" and "Rivendell", two more Tolkien-inspired songs, while Sabbath had "The Wizard."

So, at a time when the biggest rock bands were at their zeniths, D&D was born, followed shortly by the animated TV movie "The Hobbit" (1977) and the Ralph Bakshi animated "The Lord Of The Rings" (1978) On top of that, magazines like "Heavy Metal" were finding their niche, and as artists like Jack Kirby were melding sci-fi, psychedelia, and fantasy, folk like Moebius and Frank Frazetta were laying down the foundations for cyberpunk and fantasy in art.

Tolkien was propelled into the zeitgeist through rock and stayed there for a solid decade, fueled by the 70s.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

Consider this: Led Zeppelin, the greatest rock band of all-time (pipe down, grognards! Zepp is better than the Beatles and that's just the gods' honest truth), peppered their lyrics with Tolkien references. Battle of Evermore, Ramble On, Misty Mountain Hop, Over The Hills And Far Away, and arguably "Stairway To Heaven" all contain references. The gatefold of Led Zeppelin IV features Gandalf and his quote "Not all those who wander are lost." At the same time, prog-rockers Rush put out "The Necromancer" and "Rivendell", two more Tolkien-inspired songs, while Sabbath had "The Wizard."

What!??!!

To heck with DM Authority v. Player Empowerment ..... NOW YOU'VE DONE IT. You've really thrown down the gauntlet.

Led Zeppelin is a third-rate band that plagiarized better bands, and wouldn't be considered one of the top five rock bands of the 70s, let alone all time.

It wasn't even the best rock band that Jimmy Page was in.

 

[embee]

What!??!!

To heck with DM Authority v. Player Empowerment ..... NOW YOU'VE DONE IT. You've really thrown down the gauntlet.

Led Zeppelin is a third-rate band that plagiarized better bands, and wouldn't be considered one of the top five rock bands of the 70s, let alone all time.

It wasn't even the best rock band that Jimmy Page was in.

You want a Dadrock fight? You're gonna get a Dadrock fight...

Zeppelin is better than, not only the Beatles, but also The Who. By a factor of one quadrillion to the fourth power.

 

[Oofta]

Hey now! We don't need yet another thread shut down because of band wars. Can't we just all agree that certain topics are just verboten?

Besides, everybody knows that Aerosmith was the best rock band ever.

 

[DND_Reborn]

I'll admit I'm a new school D&D player/DM. I've never discounted a player idea in osr or 5e, but I still wonder. Dwarves, elves, halflings... and so on.

Why do people chose these races?

To me, elves and dwarves are just humans with some tokrm magic element. Turtle people, and cat people and demon people and dragon people seem like a fun experience. Why playa dwarf and not a mountain dwelling human miner? Why wood elves and not tribal forest dwelling humans? Wealthy human wizards instead of high elves? I mean are humans even relevant in D&D anymore?

Is it a role-playing thing, or just a ability bonus power-up thing? I don't think I've ever ran a group that had a single human in it.

I've never seen a D&D group without a single human in it until we started our online monk game as a lark and had a bird-man, cat-man, and turtle-man as the monks. Since then, a human and dwarf have joined them. We only did this because I rationalized a "zootopia-like" animal-man kingdom/continent elsewhere in the world where the other races are the outsiders.

Barring some storyline/world-building reason like this, most of the time when people play the more unusual races (pretty much anything after AD&D 1E), I find it a bit tedious and silly. shrug

 

[embee]

Hey now! We don't need yet another thread shut down because of band wars. Can't we just all agree that certain topics are just verboten?

Besides, everybody knows that Aerosmith was the best rock band ever.

Toys In The Attic is a truly great album. Pump is a great album as well (the essence of Aerosmith Part II).

But Done With Mirrors is a real thing that really exists (as is the bands entire output after Get A Grip). I say this as someone who's first CD was "Aerosmith." And I still have that CD.

And I'm sorry Morrus.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

You want a Dadrock fight? You're gonna get a Dadrock fight...

Zeppelin is better than, not only the Beatles, The Who. By a factor of one quadrillion to the fourth power.

I will now provide a short ranking of rock bands that are better than Led Zeppelin:

Pink Floyd, Beatles, AC/DC, Queen, Sabbath, Stones, Metallica, Velvet Underground, Who, Cream, Kinks, Hendrix, Clash, Police ....

You know what? The Monkees rocked harder than they did. Yeah, that's right.

and that's before getting into modern bands!

 

[embee]

I will now provide a short ranking of rock bands that are better than Led Zeppelin:

Pink Floyd, Beatles, AC/DC, Queen, Sabbath, Stones, Metallica, Velvet Underground, Who, Cream, Kinks, Hendrix, Clash, Police ....

You know what? The Monkees rocked harder than they did. Yeah, that's right.

and that's before getting into modern bands!

True fact: Pink Floyd makes me physically nauseous.

Because once on shrooms, I watched the record on the turntable spin until I vomited. I can't listen to Floyd without feeling queasy.

That said, except for Metallica, none of those bands had the fantasy influence of Zep or influenced fantasy as much as Zep. And for that reason alone, Zep holds a place near and dear in my heart.

Also, because the live version of "Whole Lotta Love" from "The Song Remains The Same" is one of the most hard-charging songs there is.

 

[Snarf Zagyg]

True fact: Pink Floyd makes me physically nauseous.

Because once on shrooms, I watched the record on the turntable spin until I vomited. I can't listen to Floyd without feeling queasy.

That said, except for Metallica, none of those bands had the fantasy influence of Zep or influenced fantasy as much as Zep. And for that reason alone, Zep holds a place near and dear in my heart.

Also, because the live version of "Whole Lotta Love" from "The Song Remains The Same" is one of the most hard-charging songs there is.

Fair enough, music preference are intensely personal! I would say that Zeppelin AND Sabbath both had a lot to do with the fantasy feedback loop.

Sorry to hear about Pink Floyd. I caught them in concert (post Waters, not quite that old) and they were still amazing. Or .. um ... I was in the mood for them to be amazing. Six of one, etc.

 

[embee]

Fair enough, music preference are intensely personal! I would say that Zeppelin AND Sabbath both had a lot to do with the fantasy feedback loop.

Sorry to hear about Pink Floyd. I caught them in concert (post Waters, not quite that old) and they were still amazing. Or .. um ... I was in the mood for them to be amazing. Six of one, etc.

It's okay. My daughter will undoubtedly start punishing me with it when she turns 10. Just because it gives me flashbacks doesn't mean that I expurgated Dark Side from my record collection.