[+] Star Trek Discovery (Fan) Thread

[Umbran]

I was prepared to be disappointed by the explanation for the Burn, but I kinda... wasn't. In a season whose theme is trauma and its aftermath, shown at both the personal and civilizational level, the Burn being the product of a single child's pain worked for me.

Fair. I don't think they set that analogy up quite well enough, if that's how we are to take it.

The production design for the episode helped a lot.

I agree. In general, the production design and quality have been excellent. And, given the proposition, even the writing is doing fine. I'm just not a fan of the base idea. If I stuff that aside, though, the show was good.

And I'm also looking forward to see what kind of ethical dilemma is in store next week -- they really should have named the planet Omelas IV or something...

Given that the Kelpian homeworld was under attack by The Chain, you mean?

 

[Mallus]

Fair. I don't think they set that analogy up quite well enough, if that's how we are to take it.

I don't think it was meant as an analogy, exactly, just another expression of the season's central theme.

I'm just not a fan of the base idea. If I stuff that aside, though, the show was good.

I'm not sure I think it was a good idea so much as it surprised me and I had apparently done an excellent job lowering my expectations.

Given that the Kelpian homeworld was under attack by The Chain, you mean?

No, I was thinking more of a 'needs of the many/needs of the one' situation with Su'Kal. His well-being pitted against the Federation's need for a planetful of dilithium (this is why I alluded to LeGuin's "The Ones Who Walk Away From Omelas").

Which may not be what the writers are going for at all.

 

[Umbran]

No, I was thinking more of a 'needs of the many/needs of the one' situation with Su'Kal. His well-being pitted against the Federation's need for a planetful of dilithium ...

Becomes even more interesting if the Kelpian homeworld gets it butt handed to it by the Emerald Chain.

 

[Morrus]

I assume (and hope) they'll use time travel and undo the Burn. Otherwise the bright future of Star Trek is not a bright future. The optimistic view of Roddenberry's vision would be lost. I can't imagine they are not going to use the Guardian of Forever to undo the Burn though.

 

[Umbran]

I assume (and hope) they'll use time travel and undo the Burn.

Ugly precedent, that. Don't like how things turned out? Just hit the reset button!

"All time travel technology is banned!"
"Yeah, yeah, look, if you want it bad enough, you can manage it, and make the universe into what you want!'
"You want another Time War? Because this is how you get a Time War."

 

[Morrus]

Ugly precedent, that. Don't like how things turned out? Just hit the reset button!

"All time travel technology is banned!"
"Yeah, yeah, look, if you want it bad enough, you can manage it, and make the universe into what you want!'
"You want another Time War? Because this is how you get a Time War."

I guess we’re hoping for different things.

 

[MarkB]

I assume (and hope) they'll use time travel and undo the Burn. Otherwise the bright future of Star Trek is not a bright future. The optimistic view of Roddenberry's vision would be lost. I can't imagine they are not going to use the Guardian of Forever to undo the Burn though.

I really hope they don't do that, and I don't see things pointing that way. The Burn wasn't caused by temporal intervention, so the Guardian won't allow anyone to use it to go back and undo events. The fact that they specifically waited until after they'd sent Georgiou back to the past before progressing the Burn storyline seems deliberate, ensuring that she doesn't carry the knowledge that would be required to undo it.

Disasters happen, sometimes on a massive scale, and we don't get to just go back and press the reset button. The Federation had 900 years of shining success, and that's longer than most civilisations get. In this of all years, surely the story to be told should be how to build a better future from the present in which we find ourselves, rather than trying to wipe it away as though it never happened.

 

[Morrus]

I really hope they don't do that, and I don't see things pointing that way. The Burn wasn't caused by temporal intervention, so the Guardian won't allow anyone to use it to go back and undo events. The fact that they specifically waited until after they'd sent Georgiou back to the past before progressing the Burn storyline seems deliberate, ensuring that she doesn't carry the knowledge that would be required to undo it.

Disasters happen, sometimes on a massive scale, and we don't get to just go back and press the reset button. The Federation had 900 years of shining success, and that's longer than most civilisations get. In this of all years, surely the story to be told should be how to build a better future from the present in which we find ourselves, rather than trying to wipe it away as though it never happened.

I hope not. I want our future depicted in Trek to be Roddenberry’s utopia. That’s what attracts me to the franchise — the optimism and that vision of the future.

I get that other people want other things from Star Trek, but that’s a big linchpin for me. That particular vision of the future. (Which is partly why I always felt that jumping ahead 1000 years was a mistake, but I may be in minority there).

 

[MarkB]

I hope not. I want our future depicted in Trek to be Roddenberry’s utopia. That’s what attracts me to the franchise — the optimism and that vision of the future.

I get that other people want other things from Star Trek, but that’s a big linchpin for me. That particular vision of the future. (Which is partly why I always felt that jumping ahead 1000 years was a mistake, but I may be in minority there).

Well, I really hope you get to see that. But I hope you see it in the Christopher Pike series rather than in Discovery, because this show is definitely more about the journey than that destination.

 

[Umbran]

I guess we’re hoping for different things.

No. You just don't seem to want think of a way to that without time travel.

I want a Star Trek that doesn't write itself into corners that are repeatedly resolved by undoing the plot they already wrote. The fact of the matter is that a Star Trek that is based on a limited natural resource will always fall short of a perpetual utopia. That word LIMITED kills that dream, you know.

Rather than hope they write a time-travel way to undo what has happened (which still leaves them with a galaxy running low on dilithium, remember), how about you hope they find a way to utopia via something other than dilithium? I dunno... how about... trilithium? Or quadrotriticalithium? Or something other than undoing the past rather than working in the present.

They have, right on hand, a planet of weird minerals, and a character that interacts with those minerals. Have him create or reveal something that can be the basis for drive systems. Poof, The Burn is resolved without time travel, and the galaxy can move forward.