D&D 5E Moving out of concealment to attack - when is stealth broken?

[doctorbadwolf]

I'm ... not. Just saying that if the DM thinks there should be disadvantage there is. The stealth rules are left vague so that the DM can make decisions that make sense in the moment.

Then why do you keep replying to me to make points that aren’t relevant to what I said, to try and explain things I’ve shown no ignorance of, that don’t inform what I commented on in any way?

 

[auburn2]

I think your concerns are a bit... exaggerated.

The PHB (p177) says:

I certainly don't read that as "360 degree field of vision at all times". Does anyone?

Not all at once, but over a turn yes. They are turning their head back and forth and scanning the battlefield a lot faster than someone walking could sneak up on them.

 

[Oofta]

Then why do you keep replying to me to make points that aren’t relevant to what I said, to try and explain things I’ve shown no ignorance of, that don’t inform what I commented on in any way?

I was clarifying the rules for anyone reading the thread. Not sure why that bothers you.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Not all at once, but over a turn yes. They are turning their head back and forth and scanning the battlefield a lot faster than someone walking could sneak up on them.

Which is...just wild.

 

[auburn2]

the phb rules are backward. perception should have disad in combat.

Passive perception or active perception? If we are using logic, passive perception should have advantage in combat as your senses are heightened. You are literally fighting for your life and your senses are heightened.

You should have disadvantage on passive perception when you are in the 7th hour of your watch at the guard post and dreaming about what you are going to do with your girlfriend when you get off in an hour.

If it was active perception I could understand your logic, it is harder to actively search while blocking, dodging etc.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

I was clarifying the rules for anyone reading the thread. Not sure why that bothers you.

You were replying to me, with responses that didn’t relate to my posts that you were quoting.

IME, people do that when they are bothered by what they’re replying to, not just at random, for no reason.

 

[doctorbadwolf]

Passive perception or active perception? If we are using logic, passive perception should have advantage in combat as your senses are heightened. You are literally fighting for your life and your senses are heightened.

You should have disadvantage on passive perception when you are in the 7th hour of your watch at the guard post and dreaming about what you are going to do with your girlfriend when you get off in an hour.

If it was active perception I could understand your logic, it is harder to actively search while blocking, dodging etc.

Ive been in some fights. I also have many friends who have been in actual combat.

Your senses are narrowed, and difficult to master, in a fight. You are much less likely to notice someone sneak up on you, and will notice more detail within your narrowed field of vision.

 

[auburn2]

Which is...just wild.

I am in the Navy and I think of it like being on the flight deck of an aircraft carrier during flight operations. The flight deck is a dangerous environment. You have all kinds of threats, you can be blown overboard, sucked into an intake, chopped up by an E-2 propellor, walk off the flight deck and fall into the catwalk .... There is a term we use "keep your head on a swivel" because if you are paying too much attention and concentrating on that Hornet that is turning and about to blast you with his jet exhaust you are going to miss the other Hornet that is about to run you over. So that is what you are doing - while you are doing whatever your job is you are at the same time constantly scanning 360 degrees for other "threats". This is a trained behavior, not a natural one.

We are not talking about a duel or gladiator arena, and as such, I would imagine trained fighters in combat are going to do the same thing, constantly search for new threats.

 

[auburn2]

Ive been in some fights. I also have many friends who have been in actual combat.

Your senses are narrowed, and difficult to master, in a fight. You are much less likely to notice someone sneak up on you, and will notice more detail within your narrowed field of vision.

You are assuming that such fighters have no reason to think someone is sneaking up on them. They are assuming someone is trying to do exactly that, they are going to be looking for that and as you said will notice more when they do.

You are also missing that training is used specifically and purposely to counter this. It is difficult to reason effectively under stress, so through practice and training you develop muscle memory and practiced behaviors to do what you intend.

Comparing it to modern combat - your footwork if shooting while moving and your sight picture are examples of this. You practice it over and over again so it is second nature and you don't need to think about it when you are in a gunfight. I would think a fantasy combatant scanning for enemies sneaking up on you would be the same.

 

[Charlaquin]

I keep thinking about this video:

That’s not really stealth though.