D&D 5E Volo's 5e vs Tasha's 5e where do you see 5e heading?

[Parmandur]

Evergreen was the approach when 5E was an apology edition that WotC was afraid wasn't even going to win back PF players or hold on to 4E players.

Evergreen is unlikely to be the approach when you've been seeing 33% year on year growth and allegedly have 50m+ players.

The evergreen approach is about the game being a steady source of fan engagement with a broader brand.

 

[Parmandur]

Oh?

Is this a new development, or did they also understand evergreen in 1999?

Also: evergreen and trading card game are two flavors that do not taste great together.

Yes, Hasbto already had a number of Evergreen board games that were generations old in 1999: Monopoly, Clue, Risk, G.I. Joez etc...

 

[Ruin Explorer]

The evergreen approach is about the game being a steady source of fan engagement with a broader brand.

Sure, though that wasn't player perception at the time - that was a much more literalistic "this will be the last edition of D&D" thought.

But I doubt many of the new players were even around when the evergreen comment was made, or would be surprised to see a new edition (I doubt it'll be themed a la Catan or the like btw, that would potentially limit sales).

Board games are bad model, I'd suggest. MtG is closer, but D&D is its own thing and assuming it will function identically to another market/product will only lead to tears.

 

[ph0rk]

Yes, Hasbto already had a number of Evergreen board games that were generations old in 1999: Monopoly, Clue, Risk, G.I. Joez etc...

5e will be the last edition until WotC/Hasbro decides it is time to cash in on a new edition. They aren't a gaming nonprofit.

 

[Parmandur]

Sure, though that wasn't player perception at the time - that was a much more literalistic "this will be the last edition of D&D" thought.

But I doubt many of the new players were even around when the evergreen comment was made, or would be surprised to see a new edition (I doubt it'll be themed a la Catan or the like btw, that would potentially limit sales).

Board games are bad model, I'd suggest. MtG is closer, but D&D is its own thing and assuming it will function identically to another market/product will only lead to tears.

The board game model is what WotC has consistently held up as theit goal for years now. And the themed versions is in effect already, we saw the equivalent of my Legend of Zelda Monopoly game drop just last week: Gothic Horrornflavored D&D. The board game model seems to be working for WotC so far, and is a better indication of future decisions than past failed models.

 

[Parmandur]

5e will be the last edition until WotC/Hasbro decides it is time to cash in on a new edition. They aren't a gaming nonprofit.

That assumes that a new edition as a marketing push is effective. History suggests that it is not. I'm not saying there won't be a 6E, certainly there will be. But it will look more like the most recent Monopoly edition, (9th or 20th, IIRC), not prior D&D rollout. Background that most people don't notice beyond some cool new book covers.

 

[ph0rk]

The board game model is what WotC has consistently held up as theit goal for years now.

The problem is board games are self contained, and changing rules is simple.

Not sure for a P&P TTRPB - eventually new editions of books are required, whether that's an updated PHB, a 5.5e, or a 6e.

That assumes that a new edition as a marketing push is effective. History suggests that it is not.

It was for 3e, 3.5e, and 5e.

 

[Parmandur]

The problem is board games are self contained, and changing rules is simple.

Not sure for a P&P TTRPB - eventually new editions of books are required, whether that's an updated PHB, a 5.5e, or a 6e.


It was for 3e, 3.5e, and 5e.

Individual campaigns, which usually last a year, are self contained.

The existence of 3.5 shows the problem there right away. And 5E was a build up as much as anything.

 

[ph0rk]

The existence of 3.5 shows the problem there right away.

3.5e sold tons of books (for the time). Hell, 4e sold plenty of books early. And the attempt to take back the SRD was as big a blunder with 4e as anything stylistic in that edition.

Probably a bigger blunder than the at will/daily/encounter powers was.

Given the size of 5e's player base, a set of 5.5e books would sell better (in that quarter) than any previous core release.

 

[Argyle King]

• Moving away from short rest abilities.
• More abilities keyed-off the proficiency bonus.

I also see this being the case. A lot of newer options say something along the lines of "...you can do this a number of times equal to your proficiency bonus; the number of uses recharges after a long rest." Recharging on a short rest appears less frequently.

I also see the psi-dice concept being used in other ways. For example, I could see a paladin variant which uses "holy dice" to protect allies and produce various effects rather than having spells. I could also see smite being limited to a number of times per long rest equal to proficiency bonus, with additional smites being possible by sacrificing a use of holy dice.