D&D General What’s The Big Deal About Psionics?

[Maxperson]

And since anyone apparently can get magic powers from some shady guy offering pacts in a dark alley, they're not even all that special in-universe either.

I've played with many DMs who have Adventuring Guilds in various cities. Now I'm half tempted to install Pact Offices, where representatives of the various fiends, celestials, fey and other powers that be wait with standard contracts.

 

[James Gasik]

I saw a LOT of multiclassed Warlocks when I played in Adventurer's League, so that quickly became my running joke as to the source of their powers.

 

[Yaarel]

Looks good, but I would make a few changes. I think a charm duration of a day goes against the balance levels for 5e. Even dominate monster at 8th level only works for up to an hour.

At Higher Levels. When you cast this spell:
For each slot level higher, you can target one additional creature.
At two slot levels higher, the creature types include aberrations, beasts, celestials, dragons, fey, fiends, giants and monstrosities.
At four slot levels higher, the creature types include constructs, elementals, oozes, plants, and undead with an intelligence higher than 3.

Dont forget, 3e two points = one slot.

I wouldnt worry about itemizing creature types. Let two slots (= four points) handle any Nonhumanoid type.

Edit: That's assuming a spell slot format. If it were spell points as I prefer, it would be similar, but would cost a varying amount of points instead.

Regarding 5e spell points.

The 5e spells themselves need a clean up anyway.

But I recommend only using points for slot levels 1 to 6, and treating slots 7 to 9 separately.

I need to comb thru spells to determine precise costs. But suppose that a "decent" slot 3 spell costs 5 points, but an "excellent" slot 3 spell, like Fireball, costs 6 points. This setup allows the point costs to run consistently from 1 point to 12 points. These point costs roughly correspond to character level, but still allows for some wiggle room such as a level 5 Wizard spending 6 points to cast Fireball.

In any case, slots 7, 8, and 9 would not be able to use points so as to prevent spamming powerful spells.

When a robust spell point system exists, a Wizard could liquidate the default slots for points instead, or oppositely, a Psion ise default points to "purchase" slots instead.

 

[Maxperson]

In any case, slots 7, 8, and 9 would not be able to use points so as to prevent spamming powerful spells.

I don't see a reason to limit that. Sure allowing it would let them spam powerful spells.....................for 2 fights. Then they will be out of points for the next 4-6 fights of the adventuring day and be reduced to the psionic equivalent of cantrips.

 

[Yaarel]

I don't see a reason to limit that. Sure allowing it would let them spam powerful spells.....................for 2 fights. Then they will be out of points for the next 4-6 fights of the adventuring day and be reduced to the psionic equivalent of cantrips.

Suppose, Wish costs 18 points, then three Fireballs (6 points each) could instead be an extra Wish spell. With many Wishes from spare points. And the official DMG point system is worse! It seems wiser to remove these high slot spells from the point system.

 

[Maxperson]

Suppose, Wish costs 18 points, then three Fireballs (6 points each) could instead be an extra Wish spell. With many Wishes from spare points. And the official DMG point system is worse! It seems wiser to remove these high slot spells from the point system.

Nah. First, Wish = some other spell of 8th level or lower unless you want to risk losing the ability to use it. So go ahead and cast it 3 times. You've just spent most of your spell points to cast some other spells of under 9th level and taken yourself out of almost every other fight for the adventuring day in the process. Sure you'll own that one fight, but overall you've made the day harder for you and your group.

 

[jgsugden]

How is this not a sorcerer?

Speaking from the perspective of in campaign lore:

Sorcerers gain their power through the weave, while Psions do not. The source of power of a sorcerer is external to their body, while the psionic characters are generators of their own power. The sorcerer has a connection to a supernatural force that allows them to access the weave. However, they depend upon that weave access for their magic, and anti-magic, detection of magic, etc... all work with/for them because they are tied to the weave.

This is why the sorcerer is mechanically similar to a wizard. They use their heritages to tap into the weave and gather power that they, like a bard, can shape with their force of personality (charisma) - but it is also why they are mechanically different from a psionic character - because those characters are not restricted, or benefited, by access to the weave.

• A cleric or paladin asks for magic, and it is given to them through the weave.
• A druid or ranger is awash in the weave, feeling the flow of the magic from the positive energy plane to the negative energy plane (and back), and just guides thet flow into their spells, working with the currents.
• A wizard reaches into the weave and pulls, manipulates and twists that magic to create their spells, using precision and focus to craft magic.
• A sorcerer opens up to the weave and draws magic in using the elements of their heritage (or whatever otherworldy influence permeates them), and through force of personality pushes it into shape.
• A bard doesn't have some supernatural origin element to help them push the magic into shape - they're all ego, baby, and they get it done by being who they are.
• A warlock is delivered the raw magic via the web, but must use their force of personality to shape it.
• A monk, psion, or psychic warrior don't look to the weave for their power. They look inside. They've trained their souls and spirits to create power without the aid of the weave, thus allowing them to do things that weave based casters can't - and also thus being unable to do things that weave casters can, as some key magical effects depend upon how magic flows from the weave.

 

[Micah Sweet]

Speaking from the perspective of in campaign lore:

Sorcerers gain their power through the weave, while Psions do not. The source of power of a sorcerer is external to their body, while the psionic characters are generators of their own power. The sorcerer has a connection to a supernatural force that allows them to access the weave. However, they depend upon that weave access for their magic, and anti-magic, detection of magic, etc... all work with/for them because they are tied to the weave.

This is why the sorcerer is mechanically similar to a wizard. They use their heritages to tap into the weave and gather power that they, like a bard, can shape with their force of personality (charisma) - but it is also why they are mechanically different from a psionic character - because those characters are not restricted, or benefited, by access to the weave.

• A cleric or paladin asks for magic, and it is given to them through the weave.
• A druid or ranger is awash in the weave, feeling the flow of the magic from the positive energy plane to the negative energy plane (and back), and just guides thet flow into their spells, working with the currents.
• A wizard reaches into the weave and pulls, manipulates and twists that magic to create their spells, using precision and focus to craft magic.
• A sorcerer opens up to the weave and draws magic in using the elements of their heritage (or whatever otherworldy influence permeates them), and through force of personality pushes it into shape.
• A bard doesn't have some supernatural origin element to help them push the magic into shape - they're all ego, baby, and they get it done by being who they are.
• A warlock is delivered the raw magic via the web, but must use their force of personality to shape it.
• A monk, psion, or psychic warrior don't look to the weave for their power. They look inside. They've trained their souls and spirits to create power without the aid of the weave, thus allowing them to do things that weave based casters can't - and also thus being unable to do things that weave casters can, as some key magical effects depend upon how magic flows from the weave.

See, to me the Weave is an explicitly FR thing, and I hated that it was applied to D&D as a whole in 5e.

 

[Yaarel]

Nah. First, Wish = some other spell of 8th level or lower unless you want to risk losing the ability to use it. So go ahead and cast it 3 times. You've just spent most of your spell points to cast some other spells of under 9th level and taken yourself out of almost every other fight for the adventuring day in the process. Sure you'll own that one fight, but overall you've made the day harder for you and your group.

Hypothetically, it can be balanced to cast Wish multiple times (but it might be more like 8 times per day) - if every spell in the game is carefully balanced and is accurately worth its slot/point cost.

Given the 5e design of scarcity of high slot spells, it seems safer to keep them scarce.

Any way, I will look caefully at spells, their balance, and their costs and come up with a hopefuly robust system.

 

[Minigiant]

A big problem is that WOTC and a large chunk of the community want the Wizard to have access to almost every supernatural effect. The only limitations being on direct healing and revival.

The Sorcerer and Psion are mostly pointless unless they get exclusive effects. However there is always this itching pull to share out their aspects.