D&D (2024) The future of edition changes and revisions

[Parmandur]

If the pushback is respectful, and intended to further discussion and understanding, rather than an attempt to shut down a line of discussion altogether? Sure.

Who says it isn't...? But either way, there are dozens of us here, dozens!

 

[Malmuria]

1. The player base is different - much larger, younger, and generally more casual.
2. There are far few products in 5E than in previous editions at a similar point, at least going back to 2E.

So my question, or rather open-ended speculation, is how will WotC handle an edition change/revision differently from in the past, and how will the player base respond?

My guess is that they will err on keeping the product line as simple as possible. A big chunk of your audience are people who don't pay close attention to each release, keeping a running log of change in mechanics, or are widely read in lore. Keeping the old core books in print, or keeping Vgtm or mtof in print, is just confusing for casual consumers. In fact, a major edition change is confusing for casual consumers. Thus, the anniversary edition will be largely compatible with the current edition, unless they want to every adventure 5e to go out of print.

 

[JEB]

Who says it isn't...? But either way, there are dozens of us here, dozens!

If someone is suggesting that complainers are hypocrites because they only complain about some changes and not others, or that complainers are so few in number as to be irrelevant, or that even the complaints themselves are unimportant, that's an attempt to intimidate and shame complainers into silence. And it certainly isn't showing respect for their point of view, or seeking to understand that point of view.

 

[Staffan]

moved the Forgotten Realms to the forefront over Greyhawk.

There's a difference?

 

[Hussar]

If someone is suggesting that complainers are hypocrites because they only complain about some changes and not others, or that complainers are so few in number as to be irrelevant, or that even the complaints themselves are unimportant, that's an attempt to intimidate and shame complainers into silence. And it certainly isn't showing respect for their point of view, or seeking to understand that point of view.

Well, it is a bit hypocritical no?

"I think that canon and lore is very important and that you should not change things in the game" is a VERY different stance from "I only think canon and lore are important when it affects me personally, otherwise, change whatever you like, I don't care".

Having had to listen to that second one for the past fifteen years or so, my tolerance is pretty close to zero. Having people come and take big steaming dumps in EVERY SINGLE DISCUSSION dealing with D&D, endlessly, without cease, tends to make me really, really salty. We've been hearing this song and dance now for DECADES. So, yeah, I'm not really seeking to understand the point of view anymore.

Someone doesn't like change X. Ok, fair enough. No problem. I totally get that. There are all sorts of things I don't like or would like to see in D&D. My three most favorite classes in D&D are paladins, binders and warlords. Paladins have been completely rewritten. Binders had their junk stolen by warlocks and warlords got completely thrown under the bus. Now, I could keep bitching and moaning about this. And, I'll be the first to admit, I did a fair bit of that about warlords in the early days of 5e. But, at some point, I just have to realize that nope, I'm not going to get what I want and move on.

I mean, good grief, it's never, EVER stopped. All through 3e I had to listen to people bitch and complain about how the game I liked was ruining D&D. Then 4e came along and LOTS MORE people, with a lot bigger axe to grind, endlessly bitched and complained about how 4e was ruining D&D. Now, every freaking announcement thread or discussion of the future is littered with the same thing - WOtC is destroying D&D and hates its fans.

But, no, I'm supposed to be the one to be understanding and respectful. I'm just so sick and tired of it. It never, ever stops. I get not liking something. Totally understand that. DO NOT UNDERSTAND the endless bitching about it over and over and over again.

 

[MonsterEnvy]

There's a difference?

Yes. Greyhawk is more swords and sorcery, and has Kingdoms and Nations in the area that gets the most attention as opposed to the Sword Coasts City States. Also about half of them are evil in Greyhawk

 

[JEB]

"I think that canon and lore is very important and that you should not change things in the game" is a VERY different stance from "I only think canon and lore are important when it affects me personally, otherwise, change whatever you like, I don't care".

"Nothing should ever change" is a very rare and extreme point of view among folks who like canon. (I've seen it from maybe one person on these boards, not a regular.) Usually folks are tolerant to varying degrees of canon changes, as long as it's primarily additive and doesn't create a contradiction with past canon (or at least a contradiction that can be explained). The better the change can work with past canon, the less complaining; the less compatible, the more complaints you get. (This is why reboots tend to be poorly received, since they're fundamentally incompatible.)

Also worth noting that if someone had no strong feelings about a particular element of canon, it's likely less that they're giving permission to do whatever, and more like it's off their radar. If you didn't know that merrow used to be sea ogres and not corrupted merfolk, you aren't likely to even notice the change.

In short: people can like canon and still be fine with some changes. People are complicated, and it doesn't make them hypocrites.

I'm just so sick and tired of it. It never, ever stops. I get not liking something. Totally understand that. DO NOT UNDERSTAND the endless bitching about it over and over and over again.

Being irritated by complaints is understandable, but it doesn't make it fine to intimidate and shame those that do the complaining. Keep in mind that the ones who asked for changes to problematic lore were complaining as well, and their complaints absolutely irritated people... would it have been OK for those complainers to be bullied into silence by the ones they irritated?

If you can't ignore the complaints, then just block the complainers and be done with it. You won't see them, they won't see you. Seems like that might be the best solution to your problem.

 

[DarkCrisis]

There's a difference?

And here’s the modern problem. No, not every setting is the same and they absolutely should not be.

This is why a lot of Dragonlance fans are currently unhappy. They are trying to make it more generic so it fits into the same grey box as every other setting.

 

[TwoSix]

This is why a lot of Dragonlance fans are currently unhappy. They are trying to make it more generic so it fits into the same grey box as every other setting.

I’m not saying they’re not, but do we have enough information outside the UA to make that determination?

 

[DarkCrisis]

I’m not saying they’re not, but do we have enough information outside the UA to make that determination?

The toning down of Kender (yeah yeah Kender) and changing the Tower of High Sorcery and how the 3 different robed mages works is a prime example.

I’m actually anxious to see if they mention that Orcs (this Half-Orcs) and Drow don’t exist in Krynn. Or that Draconians are strictly evil during the War of the Lance time period.