DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
First, to be clear, I never said "all the casters".
My point is 9 times out of 10, they use cantrips. The 1 out of 10 times they have a weapon is because they need one for cantrips like shillelagh, GFB, or BB.
D&D 5E [+]What does your "complex fighter" look like?
My point is 9 times out of 10, they use cantrips. The 1 out of 10 times they have a weapon is because they need one for cantrips like shillelagh, GFB, or BB.
Yeah when I play a Wizard in 5e, there's really no purpose to carrying a weapon around. I usually have a dagger in my inventory because it's useful as a tool, but I don't wave it around or try to stab people with it!
Sure, I might run into an enemy I can't Firebolt, but I think even a humble Help action to one of my allies is going to be better than "throwing darts".
But at the same time, it wouldn't be hard to set a Wizard up to be a weapon user. Even ignoring the Bladesong cantrips, most Wizards like Dexterity, so all they need is proficiency and they can use a rapier or bow if they wanted.
AC was solved with the PHB, and it's only gotten easier, now that any race can get you the +2 Int you want.
(And, as an aside, how about Tortle Bladesingers? Why yes, I don't mind a 22 AC without wearing a scrap of armor!).
Sure, I might run into an enemy I can't Firebolt, but I think even a humble Help action to one of my allies is going to be better than "throwing darts".
But at the same time, it wouldn't be hard to set a Wizard up to be a weapon user. Even ignoring the Bladesong cantrips, most Wizards like Dexterity, so all they need is proficiency and they can use a rapier or bow if they wanted.
AC was solved with the PHB, and it's only gotten easier, now that any race can get you the +2 Int you want.
(And, as an aside, how about Tortle Bladesingers? Why yes, I don't mind a 22 AC without wearing a scrap of armor!).
Baron Opal II
Hero
A cleave without end... that's top tier right there. To categorize it, I would consider it more preternatural than uncanny; there's definitely some qi going on there.
In my AD&D style game one of the things that I've adopted is that all fighters have cleave, parry and smite. So, extra attacks when you down opponents, channel attack bonus into AC or damage. I also have fighters gain half their level (rounded down) as a bonus to damage. Not only does their skill with weapons allow them to strike their opponents easier, but also to do more damage.
One of the consequences of this is that about 6th level they mow down reliably 1 HD creatures. Their minimum damage is at or above the average hit points. So they are taking out 5-6 of the opposing army reliably each round. By 9th level they are reliably taking out 3-4 4 HD creatures every two rounds.
I've been adapting the Battlemaster maneuvers and that seems to be going well-ish. I've dropped the superiority die, so they can perform the maneuvers pretty much at will. The main difference is that they can inflict standard damage or minimum damage with some effect. Sometimes an ability check for the target to resist. The fighter can sacrifice attack bonus, similar to parry and smite above, to give a penalty to their check to resist. Harder to hit, but harder to resist.
So far aggro, charge (-1 to attack for an extra 5 ft move), parry, and overrun (tide of iron-ish) have been the ones used. At the moment, I consider all of the maneuvers mundane, and I'm thinking about what uncanny and preternatural levels of them would look like.
GMforPowergamers
Legend
I didn't use ANY subclass (I think I have seen champion multi into) I just read the class from D&D beyond and listed the number of time you get subclass eatures)
from level 1-10 the fighter doesn't have more weapon attacks then other primary weapon attackers (including bards, warlocks and even a subclass of wizard)
jdrakeh
Front Range Warlock
So, I'm playing a level 6 rogue (Arcane Trickster)/level 5 fighter (Rune Knight) whose gimmick is to hulk out (giant's might), grapple (grappler feat) opponents, then shank them repeatedly with my +1 rapier. I average about 25 points of magical piercing damage per hit scored (sneak attack, duelist fighting style, giant's might once per turn) and usually hit with two attacks per turn. Which, is enough for me to be happy.
Maxperson
Morkus from Orkus
That doesn't give the number of options, though. You're gimping fighters by doing that. But if you reaaaaaaly want to do it that way. Wizards get spellcasting as their feature, so the number of spells per level aren't part of that. So all of their spells from levels 1-20 = 1 feature. You would have to count that as only 1 feature at level 20, not 27(number of spell slots). See what I mean?
DND_Reborn
The High Aldwin
I agree.
While I won't count every single spell or spell slot, I do think counting access to each spell level and ritual casting works as 10 features (cantrips would make it 11, which I didn't count before).
IMO it is like counting Extra Attack (2) and Extra Attack (3) as separate from Extra Attack.
GMforPowergamers
Legend
there is a chart you can look at.... it's called the wizard
