Ryan Dancey -- Hasbro Cannot Deauthorize OGL

I reached out to the architect of the original Open Gaming License, former VP of Wizard of the Coast, Ryan Dancey, and asked his opinion about the current plan by WotC to 'deauthorize' the current OGL in favour of a new one.

He responded as follows:

Yeah my public opinion is that Hasbro does not have the power to deauthorize a version of the OGL. If that had been a power that we wanted to reserve for Hasbro, we would have enumerated it in the license. I am on record numerous places in email and blogs and interviews saying that the license could never be revoked.

Ryan also maintains the Open Gaming Foundation.

As has been noted previously, even WotC in its own OGL FAQ did not believe at the time that the licence could be revoked.

7. Can't Wizards of the Coast change the License in a way that I wouldn't like?

Yes, it could. However, the License already defines what will happen to content that has been previously distributed using an earlier version, in Section 9. As a result, even if Wizards made a change you disagreed with, you could continue to use an earlier, acceptable version at your option. In other words, there's no reason for Wizards to ever make a change that the community of people using the Open Gaming License would object to, because the community would just ignore the change anyway.

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[Steel_Wind]

Attempting to revoke an agreement after 22 years, by changing your interpretation of a key clause, could certainly be considered bad faith.

It would make most rational people think twice about entering into any new agreement with you.

That would be a fair assessment.

 

[mamba]

What was the timeline on 4e? Released in 2008, 5e in 2014. When was Essentials? And did someone mention they had stopped supporting it by 2012?

yes, seems about right, 4e 2008, essentials 2010, dropped in 2012. Kinda proving my point about it being dropped faster than any other edition... apparently because they already had all the sales they ever needed

 

[GMforPowergamers]

that claim came when, a month or so in ? It did sell better than 3.x in the beginning, that did not last long though. I was dumped faster than any other edition, and that was not because sales were so great

What was the timeline on 4e? Released in 2008, 5e in 2014. When was Essentials? And did someone mention they had stopped supporting it by 2012?

Editions of Dungeons & Dragons - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

3 to 3.5 was 2ish-3ish years
4e to essentials was 2ish-3ish years...

the difference was 4e essentials was additive not replacement.

 

[Steel_Wind]

well, Solasta has a license, so there is no need for that

Do they? Someone mentioned they did not and it was under the SRD only. If so?

Never mind?

 

[Greg Benage]

yes, seems about right, 4e 2008, essentials 2010, dropped in 2012. Kinda proving my point about it being dropped faster than any other edition... apparently because they already had all the sales they ever needed

Heh. Yeah, that's an unusual product strategy for a successful line.

 

[mamba]

yeah that's your spin. you don't have the numbers, I don't have the numbers. We have that 3.5 out sold 3, 4 out sold 3.5 and 5 out sold 4. so with this (limited) information we can say every edition out sold the one before it.

except that to my knowledge they did not say that when the total sales for each version were in but something like 2 months after 4e was released, and talking about 'opening sales', not lifetime

 

[GMforPowergamers]

yes, seems about right, 4e 2008, essentials 2010, dropped in 2012. Kinda proving my point about it being dropped faster than any other edition... apparently because they already had all the sales they ever needed

Heh. Yeah, that's an unusual product strategy for a successful line.

depends on what you consider success. If you see a split fan base as "money left on the table" then you can look at the best selling version of your game and say "Hey, can we find a way to get MORE?"

 

[mamba]

Editions of Dungeons & Dragons - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

3 to 3.5 was 2ish-3ish years
4e to essentials was 2ish-3ish years...

the difference was 4e essentials was additive not replacement.

I do not count 3.0 and 3.5 as two editions, and I do the same for 4e and essentials.

 

[GMforPowergamers]

except that to my knowledge they did not say that when the total sales for each version were in but something like 2 months after 4e was released, and talking about 'opening sales', not lifetime

again, I'm not claiming we have info we don't. We have EXACTLY what I said. it also comes from a bias source. There is NO REASON to trust WotC wouldn't spin those numbers too. BUT you don't get to make up facts just cause we don't have them. so

either 1) we go by the little we know, or 2) we go by gut. neither way will either of us convince the other of our beliefs.

 

[Greg Benage]

depends on what you consider success.

I'd define it as "don't have to try a reboot in two years and sunset in four." Anyway, while I missed it all, I know this is a fraught subject and I wasn't trying to edition war.