Are Superhero films dying?

[Zardnaar]

Without commenting on the quality of the data, 2019 looks like it was fairly consistent with the years before it, and lower than 2018.

Worldwide Yearly Box Office

www.boxofficemojo.com

Hmm thought it was bigger.

It's not to relevant though because I wasn't comparing to 2019 someone else brought that up.

If you have been paying attention MCU specifically started to wobble back with Eternals and Chang Chi. They'd have Covid as an excuse.

Black Pantger II was down roughly were you would expect due to lower numbers.
GotG3 was also down relative to 2.

I'm not expecting MCU to hit those heights.

This year specifically has been brutal on Superhero films.

This was a month ago.


The last MCU show was also panned and ratings gave been low for Ms Marvel and She Hulk.

I woukd argue tge real damage was Love and Thunder/Quantumania though.

Shang Chi and GotG3 seem to be the best regarded quality wise.

BP2 was only a year ago roughly iirc.

So the information is all out there if you gad been paying attention.

Think we are 8 super hero movies deep now only 2 gave been hits iirc.

I'm expecting Aquaman 2 to land around 400-600 million that might be an extreme burst of optimism.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Hmm thought it was bigger.

It's not to relevant though because I wasn't comparing to 2019 someone else brought that up.

If you have been paying attention MCU specifically started to wobble back with Eternals and Chang Chi. They'd have Covid as an excuse.

Black Pantger II was down roughly were you would expect due to lower numbers.
GotG3 was also down relative to 2.

I'm not expecting MCU to hit those heights.

This year specifically has been brutal on Superhero films.

This was a month ago.


The last MCU show was also panned and ratings gave been low for Ms Marvel and She Hulk.

I woukd argue tge real damage was Love and Thunder/Quantumania though.

Shang Chi and GotG3 seem to be the best regarded quality wise.

BP2 was only a year ago roughly iirc.

So the information is all out there if you gad been paying attention.

Think we are 8 super hero movies deep now only 2 gave been hits iirc.

I'm expecting Aquaman 2 to land around 400-600 million that might be an extreme burst of optimism.

2019 was the year Captain Marvel came out.
I believe the comparison was >$1B for that movie vs. whatever the Marvels makes.

GotG3 was down 2% vs GotG3. BP2 was within $4M of GotG2.

Like, what is out metric for "hit".

I'd agree that there has been a certain amount of "wobbling" vs. peak MCU releases.

But it's difficult to suss out how well-correlated the box office is with genre oversaturation, and how much is incomplete economic recovery.

 

[Zardnaar]

2019 was the year Captain Marvel came out.
I believe the comparison was >$1B for that movie vs. whatever the Marvels makes.

GotG3 was down 2% vs GotG3. BP2 was within $4M of GotG2.

Like, what is out metric for "hit".

I'd agree that there has been a certain amount of "wobbling" vs. peak MCU releases.

But it's difficult to suss out how well-correlated the box office is with genre oversaturation, and how much is incomplete economic recovery.

Well you have some MCU films hitting something vaguely decent eg 800 million.

2019 had 6 billion dollar fima. Iirc there's only been 60 ish total.

We had 2 this year none were MCU. These films are gusting north of 300 million though with marketing budgets. That's probably around Marvels final tally.

I'm jot expecting Aqyanan to hut a billion like the first one either but expectations seem to be rock bottom.

I read somewhere there's 12 suoer hero movies this year I can recall 10 at least.

 

[Gammadoodler]

Well you have some MCU films hitting something vaguely decent eg 800 million.

2019 had 6 billion dollar fima. Iirc there's only been 60 ish total.

We had 2 this year none were MCU. These films are gusting north of 300 million though with marketing budgets. That's probably around Marvels final tally.

I'm jot expecting Aqyanan to hut a billion like the first one either but expectations seem to be rock bottom.

I read somewhere there's 12 suoer hero movies this year I can recall 10 at least.

Is 1 billion dollars the cutoff for you?

Because most superhero movies don't hit that. It's pretty much just the Avengers movies, Spiderman sequels, Captain Marvel, and Black Panther.

 

[Zardnaar]

Is 1 billion dollars the cutoff for you?

Because most superhero movies don't hit that. It's pretty much just the Avengers movies, Spiderman sequels, Captain Marvel, and Black Panther.

No but they're putting out movies that require close to a billion dollars to break even.

I've seen 370+million being thrown around for Marvels cost (270 production plus marketing).

That's a 700-800 million box office right there. Marvels is between Shazam and Flash iirc.

Barbie snd Mario broke a billion on 90-100 million budgets.

Indiana Jones similar boat.

The quantity thing.

Bob Iger Said 'Quantity' Over 'Quality' Is To Blame For Marvel's Box Office Troubles. But It's Worth Noting It Was His Idea In The First Place

Just one problem, Bob: this was your idea.

www.cinemablend.com

 

[Clint_L]

We've had basically twenty years since Spiderman more or less launched the current wave of superhero franchises, and that wave probably peaked with the historic success of End Game. It kind of had nowhere to go but down, and I see that as healthy. When you have that many films all trying to get in on the action by more or less emulating each other, quality has to suffer. And that creates room for something new to happen. Give it time and someone will come along and revitalize the genre with a fresh take.

In the meantime, I am ready for a break, and apparently so are a lot of other folks.

 

[Warpiglet-7]

We've had basically twenty years since Spiderman more or less launched the current wave of superhero franchises, and that wave probably peaked with the historic success of End Game. It kind of had nowhere to go but down, and I see that as healthy. When you have that many films all trying to get in on the action by more or less emulating each other, quality has to suffer. And that creates room for something new to happen. Give it time and someone will come along and revitalize the genre with a fresh take.

In the meantime, I am ready for a break, and apparently so are a lot of other folks.

It’s not over forever but I know my emotional reaction of “cool!” To indifference when one comes out is very organic. For me it is habituation.

If they get smaller again and go with characters over flash and bang I am sure I will get lured back in one day.

 

[Kaodi]

I mean, if we are looking for a multifaceted portrayal of indigenous characters with depth, maybe (just maybe) we should be looking at Reservation Dogs and not Yellowstone?

Not to put to fine a point on it, but one is about indigenous characters, written and directed by indigenous people, and starring indigenous people, and the other is about ... well, let's just say that it is starring Kevin Costner, Klly Reilly, and Cole Hausner, and written by Taylor Sheridan.

(That's not to say that Yellowstone doesn't do a creditable job in its portrayal, but I wouldn't exactly hold it up as the gold standard.)

I think I did say I had not watched it myself and was going off of what I had read and also the few times I remembered seeing those characters when I put that show on for my Dad to watch (at a time I was literally trying to find anything for him to devour all the time, as watching TV is about all he can handle).

But to address your point: yes, something like Reservation Dogs is going to be the gold standard. But you are not living in a healthy media environment if the only people capable of doing reasonable writing about an entire race are people from that race. Imagine saying that only white people could write (well) about white people: that would be insane. So the existence of Reservation Dogs does not, in fact, obviate the need for other shows to be able to include Indigenous characters and do a decent job of it.

Oh: did I forget the post the link before or was it removed: “Yellowstone” Is The Most Important Drama On TV Right Now

 

[billd91]

Wow. I didn’t think I could be more disgusted at the Yellowstone-verse but that article got me to exceed my own expectations.

 

[Kaodi]

Wow. I didn’t think I could be more disgusted at the Yellowstone-verse but that article got me to exceed my own expectations.

...?

It has been a year since I read it in full.