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D&D (2024) 2024 needs to end 2014's passive aggressive efforts to remove magic items & other elements from d&d

Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
Small reminder.

There's been no indication that the designers are creating new tiers, which are clearly outlined in the books already.
The playtests have been experimenting with tiers in places, including Epic at 20 and other experiments.

Meanwhile having unhelpful tiers of 5−10 and 11−16, only occurs in one paragraph in the 2014 Players Handbook, with little or no support elsewhere.

The defacto tiers are the rhythm of Proficiency Bonuses and Feats, with all other class features organizing around these.

In terms of magic items, the four-level tiers are a helpful amount of granularity to assess gaming power, without going crazy.

The same four-level tiers are also a helpful amount of granularity to assign to an adventure, for what characters work best for it.
 

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CleverNickName

Limit Break Dancing (He/They)
I don't even know where to begin with this. I'll just say that--as a player, and as a DM--if I had to choose between 5e's "pick your three favorite magic items" or 3e's "everything on your character sheet is a magic item," I am going to pick 5E every single time.

Every single time.
 
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Vaalingrade

Legend
It's to keep ya from breaking it.
Just like those figurines, it's more fun that way.

but no seriously, the low magic (except for casters), faux realism concepts that the DMs who inspired the lack of magic item rules always make me wonder why bother with the fantasy game? The players don't get to do any fantasy things unless they cast it themselves, so what's the point of it being fantasy?
 

Vaalingrade

Legend
I don't even know where to begin with this. I'll just say that if I had to choose between 5e's "pick your three favorite magic items" or 3e's "everything on your character sheet is a magic item," I am going to pick 5E every single time.

Every. Single. Time.
Man, I'd love if you got to pick three magic items instead of putting on a song and dance about not needing them at all.
 

CleverNickName

Limit Break Dancing (He/They)
Man, I'd love if you got to pick three magic items instead of putting on a song and dance about not needing them at all.
...people do that?

Weird. I can understand magic items being less important in some campaigns than in others, but I don't think I'd enjoy a campaign where they were unnecessary.
 
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Yaarel

🇮🇱He-Mage
Man, I'd love if you got to pick three magic items instead of putting on a song and dance about not needing them at all.
The mechanics of body slots is kinda sorta like this. Only a few magic items are usable at any one time. But it is possible to attune a different magic item to swap it in instead.
 
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payn

He'll flip ya...Flip ya for real...
Just like those figurines, it's more fun that way.

but no seriously, the low magic (except for casters), faux realism concepts that the DMs who inspired the lack of magic item rules always make me wonder why bother with the fantasy game? The players don't get to do any fantasy things unless they cast it themselves, so what's the point of it being fantasy?
For some folks its about the adventure not about the power.
 


Vaalingrade

Legend
The mechanics of body slots is kinda sorta like this. Only a few magic items are usable at any one time. But it is possible to attune a different magic item to swap it in instead.
If you get them. Somehow that the game gives no guidance for an low key discourages.
 

tetrasodium

Legend
Supporter
Epic
I am sympathetic to player characters crafting their own magic items, including to upgrade an item. This personal touch − a mindful intention − helps maintain the flavor of a magical relationship with the item. The reparations and performance of the rituals for the item are a great hook for adventures, and the players are already immersively invested.

When things get bought-and-sold impersonally on an Amazon or EBay magic shoppe, the items feel mundane, namely a nonmagical technology.
It's possible to do magic shops pretty easily in a way that makes things far more interesting than you note. I've seen & done it in a few different ways but there is a great ~5min video explaining one of the easier & more setting agnostic yet easily seen as interesting ways of running then
It works even better if you keep a log that includes some of the notable magic items that you cycled out & have the vendors just straight up "I sold one of those a while back" or "I heard someone in $otherShop/$otherTown had one... two... three years back maybe? Not sure what happened with it
The mechanics of body slots is kinda sorta like this. Only a few magic items are usable at any one time. But it is possible to attune a different magic items to swap it in instead.
It was a bit more in depth than that & I mentioned the pg288 3.5dmg sidebar explaining how body slots are woven into magic items in the themselves in the OP. Aside from truly bizarre multiclass combos straight out of R'lyeth that probably would actually need them just to be marginally effective it was rare for a player to even be capable of finding items useful to their PCfor a good number of slots. Here's a transcript of that sidebar
BEHIND THE CURTAIN: BODY SLOT AFFINITIES
A character who already has winged boots wants the haste effect provided by boots of speed. The player asks, “Can I make a hat of speed instead?” What’s your answer?

The question comes up with some frequency because some parts of the body can accommodate many more kinds of magic items than others. Almost every character gets a magic cloak of some kind early in her career, even if it’s a simple cloak of resistance +1. But magic vests are few in number, and almost all the magic robes are too expensive for low-level characters. Characters who have “empty” spaces on their
bodies are naturally eager to fill them with useful items that would ordinarily go in spots where they already have magic.

Some magic items strain credulity if they’re placed in an unusual location on the body. It’s much easier to imagine gauntlets of ogre power than goggles of ogre power. Other changes seem straightforward enough; for instance, a cloak of blending makes just as much sense as a robe of blending.

Each location on the body, or body slot, has one or more affinities: a word or phrase that describes the general function or nature of magic items designed for that body slot. Body slot affinities are deliberately broad, abstract categorizations, because a hard-and-fast rule can’t cover the great variety among wondrous items.

You can use the affinities in the list below to guide your decisions on which magic items you’ll allow in which body slots. And when you design your own magic items, the affinities give you some guidance for what form a particular item should take.

Some body slots have different affinities for different specific items. Gloves and gauntlets occupy the same body slot, for example, but have the affinities of quickness and destructive power respectively.

Body SlotAffinity
Headband, HelmetMental Improvenment, Ranged Attacks
HatInteraction
PhylacteryMorale, Alignment
Eye Lenses, GogglesVision
Cloak, Cape, MantleTransformation, Protection
Amulet, Brooch, Medallion, Necklace, Periapt, ScarabProtection, Discernment
RobeMultiple Effects
ShirtPhysical Improvement
Vest, VestmentClass ability Improvement
BracersCombat
BraceletsAllies
GlovesQuickness
GauntletsDestructive Power
BeltPhysical Improvement
BootsMovement
Wondrous items that don’t match the affinity for a particular body slot should cost 50% more than wondrous items that match the affinity. Compare the boots of teleportation with the helm of teleportation. Unless you are intentionally aiming for a truly oddball game, avoid patently absurd combinations such as eyeglasses of giant Strength at any price.

If a player wanted to fill all their slots as people throwing shade at body slots often mention (including in this thread) it was a simple matter of turning the page in the DMG to them to read where they would realize there really is no such item as a necklace of archery boots of fireball or whatever. Even late in 3.5 it was still pretty tough to find actual published items that supported a fill every slot mentality that were much more useful than "well nobody else wants this and I'm not using anything in that slot... I might as well wear it in my empty slot since it doesn't look like selling it would get us much... does anyone mind if I do?".
 

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