D&D 5E We Would Hate A BG3 Campaign

[Micah Sweet]

Yup. The whole idea that some random GM has produced this wonderful work of art of world building which must be appreciated like the fine thing it is and set on a pedestal. Sacrilege, you will introduce an ELF into my fine artistic setting masterpiece! Guys, stop being so stuck on yourselves and go have fun. I drew a map in 1976 or so, I still use it, I mean, sure I imagined all sorts of stuff and history and all that jazz back in the day. It was fun, never paid it much attention in play. I'd get out the map and me and my sister and/or my buddies would decide "Well, hey, maybe there's killer kangeroos over here!" I mean so what? Sure its silly. We felt like being silly that day. Maybe a year later we ignored that. Its just a tool for having some fun with.

So the fact that setting integrity doesn't matter to you means that it's silly that it matters to anyone? What makes your preference on the matter any better than someone else's?

 

[Maxperson]

Less likely when trying to take a dominant stance over them.

If you can't have fun because someone is playing a thing you don't like, well.. too bad.

Conversely, if you cannot possibly enjoy playing anything other than the one thing you are insisting on, it's not the DM who is being unreasonable.

As a player I have many concepts that I would enjoy playing. If I arrive at a game and the limitations cross out a few of those, even the one I had been planning on playing, I'm not going to insist on disrupting things and playing that character. I'm simply going to set it aside for another game and play one of the many other fun options.

 

[Maxperson]

It's real interesting how in the argument, the DM morphs into 'everyone else'.

The terrible power dynamic between DM and players seems to be uniquely D&D. I don't really see any other TTRPGs where the players are just expected to sacrifice all their agency to the GM.

It isn't really about player vs. DM. That's just sort of how the dynamic plays out on the internet when people divide into camps and set their heels.

In the real world everyone at the table should be looking out for the enjoyment of everyone else. That means that if a player knows that the DM's fun would be negatively impacted by playing a dragonborn, it would be crappy for that player to arrive at the game the DM set up and try to play one. Similarly, if it doesn't really matter to the DM or setting for a warforged to exist, but the DM has said they don't exist, it would be crappy of the DM to deny the player his fun character.

The fantastic thing about RPGs is that there are tons and tons and tons of very fun concepts to play. If one is going to be unfun for someone(DM or other player), don't play it and choose something else. If nobody else's fun but the player asking for an exception is going to be negatively impacted by saying yes, the DM should say yes.

 

[AbdulAlhazred]

While I agree that fun is paramount…

I do think it’s fine for a DM to have a curated and limited range of options if they want in a particular campaign.

I really don’t have a ton of limits when I DM, but don’t think all campaigns have to have everything either.

Why does someone always have to give up what they want to do? Players can shop around and so should DMs. It’s about goodness of fit. I like 5e RAI. A friend mixed in 3e and tons of houserules. Can you imagine me demanding he play 5e RAI? I politely declined. Others played.

Again, I am very liberal in what flies when I DM, but why would I demand that of someone else? It’s their campaign and their group. Heck are we saying a DM should never experiment with all human world or whatever?

There are so many choices of class and race. So so many. We can say why does the dm exclude drow in this one campaign? But also why must this player choose the one in 100 things excluded?

It’s fine to have incongruent and humorous things in a campaign. I think it is also OK for a DM to want a tighter fit.

I am just not into to telling others how they must create even if my style differs a lot.

I'm not telling anyone what to create, I'm just questioning a pretty rampant attitude that has existed since basically time immemorial.

 

[Maggan]

I'm not telling anyone what to create, I'm just questioning a pretty rampant attitude that has existed since basically time immemorial.

Thing is, what I read from what you wrote is "unless anything goes, you're not having fun."

And I've been having fun for over thirty years curating my games and playing in curated games. Working within a box can ignite creativity that cannot be conjured if there is no box.

Much like any other creative endeavour, it's the challenges that make us tap into our brain and find solutions we didn't know were there.

Of course, "anything goes" is perfectly valid fun. As are "curated campaigns".

 

[Warpiglet-7]

I'm not telling anyone what to create, I'm just questioning a pretty rampant attitude that has existed since basically time immemorial.

Well I can accept that. But it read as “why would you be so X? You’re missing the point.”

It has existed because of everything Gygax wrote. Also it is still there in small print up to Tasha’s at the least. “Consult with your DM.”

Why? I know I want to do it. I think it should be available. The subtext continues to be the DM has some say so.

It’s all good either way. I just don’t see it as an “attitude” as much as a campaign specific choice. all good either way. But each is valid as far as I am concerned. I would like to try both approaches.

 

[Zardnaar]

Yup. The whole idea that some random GM has produced this wonderful work of art of world building which must be appreciated like the fine thing it is and set on a pedestal. Sacrilege, you will introduce an ELF into my fine artistic setting masterpiece! Guys, stop being so stuck on yourselves and go have fun. I drew a map in 1976 or so, I still use it, I mean, sure I imagined all sorts of stuff and history and all that jazz back in the day. It was fun, never paid it much attention in play. I'd get out the map and me and my sister and/or my buddies would decide "Well, hey, maybe there's killer kangeroos over here!" I mean so what? Sure its silly. We felt like being silly that day. Maybe a year later we ignored that. Its just a tool for having some fun with.

Might be story related eg elves got genocide or DMs just wants to try something different.

Mostly it's mechanical eg flyers maybe Yuan Ti. Post tashas some of the phb races are OP.

DM wanting lower power level is a valid reason imho. Eg ban the S and D tier races.

 

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

I'm not telling anyone what to create, I'm just questioning a pretty rampant attitude that has existed since basically time immemorial.

It sounds like you've had an experience with a problematic DM and you want to weave that into this conversation. Which is great... that's how conversations work! But in this instance, you're using a negative experience that you personally had to drag down the conversation by personifying anyone who's taken any sort of 'DM position' in this thread as the bugbear of your past experience.

Hard to take your comments seriously when you do that.

 

[pemerton]

So the fact that setting integrity doesn't matter to you

There is no such fact. That is not what @AbdulAlhazred posted.

 

[Ulorian - Agent of Chaos]

There is no such fact. That is not what @AbdulAlhazred posted.

Well, it literally was what he posted actually. What do you mean?