D&D (2024) 2024 Player's Handbook Reveal: "New Rogue"

"Even tricksier than it was before".

New Rogue video --


The last version of the rogue we saw as in the UA Playtest 6, last September. There's not many changes being announced here, the biggest being that the Soulknife gets to use Psychic Blades on opportunity attacks (so you don't need to have a knife as a backup weapon, and get into drawing/sheathing shenanigans), and that they now have the Vex property, and that Trip has apparently been withdrawn from the Cunning strike options.

OVERVIEW

• "our main job with the rogue was not to mess it up" -- add new twists to already wonderful design.
• Weapon mastery, such as short sword and dagger for TWF. Enough masteries to make a difference (i.e. 2).
• Cunning Strike (at 5): gives trade SA [sneak attack] dice for other effects. (Has anyone ever felt they had too many SA dice?). Poison, Trip, Withdraw [NOTE: no mention of Disarm!], with more later. Knockout at level 14.
• Steady Aim at 3, Reliable talent at 7 (as in PT6)
• Thieves Cant gives additional language too.
• Slippery Mind at 15 gives proficiency in Wisdom and Charisma (harder to banish)

SUBCLASSES

Assassin (earlier discussion here)

• benefits from Steady Aim.
• 2014 depended too much on surprise.
• Assassinate: adv on initiative, extra damage if opponent hasn't acted yet.
• NEW: You get disguise and poisoners kit with proficiency.
• NEW: Roving aim at 9: speed not reduced to zero if we use Steady Aim. (so you can move after making an attack with steady aim, but (apparently) not before
• Envenom Weapons, Death Strike (as in PT6).

Arcane Trickster

• NEW: spellcasting has no school restrictions, can now use arcane focus. more options and variety of builds.
• NEW versatile trickster at 13 lets you Trip two people (again, no mention of disarm.)
• discussion emphasizes the silliness and hijinks.

Soulknife

• "supernatural equivalent of the assassin"
• NEW: soulknife can be used on opportunity attacks ("Thank you!")
• NEW: soulknife has a mastery property (Vex -- next attack will have advantage)

Thief

• Fast Hands can activate magic item as a bonus action (as in PT6)
• Dex instead of Str for Jump and gives Climb speed. (JC claims "it technically gave you a climb speed before" -- I don't think this has ever been explicit).
• Supreme Sneak and Use Magic Device as in PT6.

I'm a little surprised at the (apparent) loss of Disarm from the options for Cunning Strike. Is this just to keep Wizards a bit safer? It was such a great option, for recreating those cinematic moments that I want a rogue to be able to do.

EDIT: SOME MORE NEW THINGS, from this video.

Some General rules revealed:

• New PHB has a sidebar for backwards compatibility and using abilities that haven’t been replaced/overwritten.
• NEW: Classes have a (class-specific) starting amount of gold – so for rogues it’s 100gp, + 50gp from background.
• In his build he takes Alert as background feat (not framed in terms of needing it to tie to Background). Possibly there is explicit permission to take any origin feat you want, and the one listed with backgrounds is exempli gratia.
• NEW: Piercer feat in the PHB (from Tasha’s, and so likely also Crusher and Slasher)
• Dazed condition from the playtest is gone.

Spoiler

More info for Rogues.

• NEW: Expertise for Rogues no longer allowed to be applied to Thieves’ tools.
• The Knock Out option at level 14 is awesome thematically, and he compares the idea of a rogue knocking someone out with a blackjack. Yes, that’s cool, and (for me) is the reason there should be finesse weapons that don’t do the stabby stabby

Info on his own build:

• If you know his builds, Colby is permissive with his exploits, allowing a lot of things that aren’t strictly RAW. In that light, it seems to me significant that he sees, even when using Variant Human in backwards compatibility, that he would only allow himself an Origin Feat (i.e. no half-feat) at level 1. That is only one person’s interpretation, but since he is generally VERY permissive in terms of his interpretations of rules, that (to me) speaks volumes.
• First Feat choice is Sentinel, lets him take an opportunity attack (to get SA again).
• Strategy: Most rounds attack with Vex, then Nick (so Bonus Action is free). In round 1, Nick first, bonus for Vex, which then would apply for any opportunity attack.
• He starts wielding Short sword and Scimitar, but later takes the Piercer feat, with which he’d want to swap the scimitar for a dagger (don’t think this was mentioned)

 

[Thommy H-H]

Unless they've changed Mage Hand to not have Verbal components any more, it's really weird to watch them act like Arcane Trickster uses the Mage Hand much... let alone AT's lv13 feature assuming they have one up during combat, with its 1 minute duration.

What? Mage Hand is the Arcane Trickster's whole shtick. That's why they can make it invisible and use it to get advantage. A 1 minute duration is also plenty for combat - are you running a lot of combats that last more than 10 rounds?

Like a wizard with Mage Armor, I basically assume an Arcane Trickster always has their Mage Hand floating around.

 

[Horwath]

Unless they've changed Mage Hand to not have Verbal components any more, it's really weird to watch them act like Arcane Trickster uses the Mage Hand much... let alone AT's lv13 feature assuming they have one up during combat, with its 1 minute duration.

just have AT gain Telekinetic feat without +1 ASI at 3rd level.

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

What? Mage Hand is the Arcane Trickster's whole shtick.

That's a bit of a strong statement for a flavor ribbon ability, don't you think.

That's why they can make it invisible and use it to get advantage. A 1 minute duration is also plenty for combat - are you running a lot of combats that last more than 10 rounds?

It has Verbal components, so no casting it stealthily. It takes an action to cast, so no casting it in combat. It has 1 minute duration, so it'd take a very limited window where you have summoned it out of hearing distance but ended up in combat. If at any time you are more than 30ft away from it, it just vanishes.

 

[Thommy H-H]

That's a bit of a strong statement for a flavor ribbon ability, don't you think.


It has Verbal components, so no casting it stealthily. It takes an action to cast, so no casting it in combat. It has 1 minute duration, so it'd take a very limited window where you have summoned it out of hearing distance but ended up in combat. If at any time you are more than 30ft away from it, it just vanishes.

With Mage Hand Legerdemain making it both invisible and movable using Cunning Action, it's honestly never occurred to me to track the action economy this closely. I just assume it's always 'on', and the AT can use Versatile Trickster whenever they haven't used a different bonus action. Judging from this interview and from the specific bonus the AT gets to Trip, I believe that's always been the design intention of the subclass.

 

[UngeheuerLich]

That's a bit of a strong statement for a flavor ribbon ability, don't you think.

If you think it is just a ribbon ability, you are doing some things wrong.

It has Verbal components, so no casting it stealthily. It takes an action to cast, so no casting it in combat. It has 1 minute duration, so it'd take a very limited window where you have summoned it out of hearing distance but ended up in combat.

Those are valid arguments though. Lets see, if the cantrip is changed a bit (no v, maybe bonus action to cast). Until then I hold my assessment.

If at any time you are more than 30ft away from it, it just vanishes.

That usually does not happen, as you move it as a bonus action as already mentioned.

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

That usually does not happen, as you move it as a bonus action as already mentioned.

It's a good thing that Rogues have no other uses for their bonus actions during combat.

 

[Micah Sweet]

if it's low magic, then ban ALL spellcasting.

How low can you go...

 

[Micah Sweet]

How is it worthless 80% of the time? See an NPC enemy with a weapon, disarm them, pick up the weapon and now the NPC is completely nerfed.

Oh well? The same thing can and should happen to PCs if an enemy can pull it off.

 

[Micah Sweet]

In Venca: Eve of Ruin, all the pick lock checks were sleight of hand with advantage if you have thief tool proficiency. I assume this is a stealth preview of how 2024 will handle opening locks and removing traps.

So short answer: gaining expertise in Sleight of Hand is equivalent to gaining expertise in Thief Tools

Too bad. I like tools.

 

[fluffybunbunkittens]

Too bad. I like tools.

Well, good news, you should be seeing more of them getting used now.
'Hey, I'll search for secret doors in this cabin, being a carpenter gives me advantage, right?'
'I'll examine the body with Medicine for signs of poison, with advantage from being a Poisoner myself.'