D&D (2024) Reworked…revised…redone….but

[FitzTheRuke]

When TSR re-issued the 2e corebooks with new covers, some new interior art, and a little new layout, the intent wasn't to get the same people to buy those books again. They updated their aesthetic design moving forward whilst keeping the content the same, and they were clear about that. Thus, it was honest.

I was selling D&D books back then, every bit as much as I do now, and from a marketing perspective, the messaging hasn't been less clear this time around. They're very similar, other than this time there is a MASSIVE amount of videos and their website, and google, and many other ways to look up what the new books are if you don't already know. That time there were a few articles in trade magazines and us FLGS-workers to tell you (which we're still here for).

There wasn't a whole ton of haters trying to spread misinformation, though.

 

[TerraDave]

In terms of starting this fast growing thread, the motivation is not semantics or the “e” word. It’s that WotC is on the record that this is a lot of change. If we take them at their word, then it’s all kinds of different. And better, as there is very strong encouragement to switch to 2024.

But there is the semantics. We are going to see 2014 holdouts, 2024 onlys, and mixed groups. They will have to be referred to in some way.

But yes the issue will go anway, in about 2 years or so. Then almost all popular 2014 content will have been updated, D&D will just mean the 2024 version, and the 2014s will be the new grognards.

 

[Clint_L]

I don't see a lot of folks refusing to update. We've found it a pretty seamless transition and, though I don't agree with every change, the vast majority just work better. But they are more like an evolution of the existing systems, so there's not much to wrap your head around. Like, my monk now uses dexterity instead of strength to grapple. That didn't take a lot of getting used to; it just seemed sort of obvious, like it should have always been that way. It really just feels to us like the same game, but improved in common sensical ways.

You really could just swap to the updated PHB at the start of the next session, take a few minutes for people to digest any changes, and then carry on.

And WotC has been smart to ensure that all the 2014 adventures and settings still work just fine, so you don't need to replace all your stuff. So you don't need to stick with the 2014 rules because of your sunk cost in them.

 

[Micah Sweet]

For anyone actually concerned about backwards compatibility, Crawford has basically said that as long as you read the 2024 book, and do exactly what it says, in a robotic fashion (my addition), then it will work. If you take the 2024 wizard and beep bop boop read it exactly as it says with no second guessing and then take the 2014 necromancer and beeop bop booep read it exactly as written... then everything will be fine.

The general consensus among people who have actually seen the book, is that for any DM who has even altered the HP of a monster statblock before, adjusting 99% of the material is simple, easy, and obviously straightforward.

As for the pointless debate about the name, though I am sure this will do nothing to shift the gnashing of teeth, I am going to put this up.

View attachment 374619

View attachment 374620

There is NO possible way to get confused here on Amazon. DnD Beyond will be equally clear.

"But, what about those poor souls who wander lost and confused into a gaming store?"

Yeah... those places that have employees who are knowledgeable about their products? Who likely answer questions every day, all day, about the things people are buying? Who likely are going to have massive promotional posters everywhere? Yep, those people have no hope. There is absolutely no possible way they could figure any of this out. I'd even bet there is nothing that could even give them pause to wonder if something might be different about the 5e rules they've been playing for years
View attachment 374621Nope, we may only lament these poor, lost, confused souls who have no conception of the fate that awaits them, which is sure to be fierce and terrible, and in no way easily solvable by speaking to someone or reading the preface for the Book, which every WoTC PHB has had, which likely references the anniversary and the 10 years since 5th edition started.

Utterly hopeless I declare it thus!

That's a lot of sarcasm for one post!

 

[Micah Sweet]

Okay. But you assume that the designers are NOT trying to make the best game that they can, because it's not the game that you want it to be. And just because that A goal is profit, does not mean that it is the most important goal. (To the designers - it's always going to be the most important goal to the money-folk at the company, those folks don't even know what the designers even do, I bet).

I told you I don't care personally what game they make, so long as it's the game the designers want. In all likelihood, that game will never be what I want, but that doesn't matter. Is 5.5 the game the creatives wanted to design, or is it the product the money people think will sell the best? Is it both?

Admittedly I have a subjective answer to that question, but we'll never really know, and I'm not inclined to assume sales and design are both equally happy here.

And you know which side wins when there's a conflict?

 

[mamba]

I told you I don't care personally what game they make, so long as it's the game the designers want.

how do you determine whether it is that?

Admittedly I have a subjective answer to that question, but we'll never really know,

sounds like you can’t

 

[SlyFlourish]

I wonder how DnDBeyond will handle the backwards compatibility...

This, and how AL handles it, are two huge questions for me.

 

[R_J_K75]

I take this to mean that you were interested enough to stay in the loop

This was 29-30 years ago so I wasn't crawling around dingy hobby shops for the most part. My buddy stole the 2E revisions out of the back of a broken-down Toyota (Farfegnugen) and sold them to me. Bottom line, I was glad to get a new set of books for a few doobies and $25.

I think unless you're living under a rock nowadays and pay no attention to the hobby, and I believe there are people that don't, that media and word of mouth are going to draw others to the store shelves where they may not be so informed (that's their own fault) on what they are buying. Caveat Emptor

 

[Remathilis]

I don't want them to be done my way, I want them done to make the best game the designers can make, to meet their design goals, and I don't want the most important of those goals to be profit.

If my goal is to serve the most exotic and elaborate meal to you that I can, is it a victory if I serve chilled monkey brains and nobody eats it? I met my goal, and all you did was vomit on the rug. Part of design is knowing your audience.

 

[soviet]

If my goal is to serve the most exotic and elaborate meal to you that I can, is it a victory if I serve chilled monkey brains and nobody eats it? I met my goal, and all you did was vomit on the rug. Part of design is knowing your audience.

There's no point adding the tenth ham sandwich to the market. Make your monkey brains game and if only three people like it so be it. Maybe three thousand people will like it.