WotC Greg Tito On Leaving WotC: 'It feels good to do something that doesn't just line the pockets of *****'

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We reported earlier that WotC's communications director Greg Tito had left his 9-year stint managing the Dungeons & Dragons brand for a political appointment as Deputy Director of External Affairs for the Washington secretary of state's office.


In a surprising turn of events, Tito criticized his former employers, saying "It feels good to do something that doesn't just line the pockets of a**holes." He later went on to clarify "Sorry. I meant "shareholders".

Tito is now Deputy Director of External Affairs for the Washington Secretary of State office in Olympia, WA.

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I didn't say the claim that they tried to reach out wasn't valid. IIRC, they never actually reached him though; hence why I mentioned registered mail. If my recollection is false, I will be glad to take that back.
How do we know they didn't reach him? We know he didn't comply. We also know he hasn't disputed the claims that he was contacted.

WotC might have left voicemails, emails, instant messages and maybe they even sent registered letters. It seems pretty logical that they did send a registered letter. It's cheap and easy and if they ever felt legal action was needed, would be foundational to claiming he knew he had something he wasn't supposed to have.

It's just as easy to assume he knew they were wanting to talk to him and wanted their product back and he simple didn't think they would escalate so he ignored it. That seems more likely to me than WotC not spending a few bucks to send a registered letter.
 

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How do we know they didn't reach him? We know he didn't comply. We also know he hasn't disputed the claims that he was contacted.

WotC might have left voicemails, emails, instant messages and maybe they even sent registered letters. It seems pretty logical that they did send a registered letter. It's cheap and easy and if they ever felt legal action was needed, would be foundational to claiming he knew he had something he wasn't supposed to have.

It's just as easy to assume he knew they were wanting to talk to him and wanted their product back and he simple didn't think they would escalate so he ignored it. That seems more likely to me than WotC not spending a few bucks to send a registered letter.
No record of them doing so. 🤷‍♂️ You can feel free to assume it into existence, of course, but then...look, this thread has become about people who always harp negatively ignoring facts in evidence or assuming facts not in evidence, so...wouldn't that be doing the same?
 

No record of them doing so. 🤷‍♂️ You can feel free to assume it into existence, of course, but then...look, this thread has become about people who always harp negatively ignoring facts in evidence or assuming facts not in evidence, so...wouldn't that be doing the same?

...um, the only facts are what the parties say.

WoTC put out an official announcement saying that they repeatedly attempted to contact him first.

If we are going to ignore the scant information we actually have, we might as well just stop discussing the facts, unless we get to a point where people say, "If you didn't see it, it didn't happen."

Or, you know, we can do what both sides that were actually involved did ... and let it go.
 

It's a similar argument to: my car is stolen. The thief sells the car to an unsuspecting dupe. I request the car back from the dupe. What's the outcome?
The situation is more like if you sold your car to a used car dealership, but made them promise to hold it for a week to give you a chance to buy it back. When you come back after 5 days you find they have already sold the car to someone else. They've broken their promise to you, but each transaction was legal and the only way you can get your car back is to hope the new owner is willing to make a deal.

Anyway, to people saying that WotC did nothing wrong, are you forgetting that the Pinkertons threatened to get the police involved? Being arrested and having your home searched is a very traumatic experience even if you know you've done nothing wrong and will be vindicated in the end. This is how they intimidated Dan into giving them his property. You really think this is OK?
 

Thanks for the analysis. I am not sure who had the greater proprietary claim over the cards...hence my opinion that someone who is an expert on the law should be involved first. As you write above, there are some maybes and mights.

That being the case, even though it's reasonable to assume that WotC got legal advice, from the point of view of the customer, a letter from WotC legal explaining the situation, with relevant law citations, seems more appropriate than a surprise visit from the Pinkertons. Lets him know due diligence has been done.
I'd agree with that second-last sentence. On the other hand, if - from WotC's perspective - time is of the essence (ie trying to control what they regard as a leak), and if they have already sent messages and received no response, then a physical visit might be seen as the appropriate next step.

I don't know what was in the messages that WotC sent. I do get the impression that perhaps this youtuber was not just a naive customer - that perhaps he knew that he had received the cards in error, and perhaps was deliberately not responding to WotC's communications in order to not expose his own position to attack. But that's just conjecture, based on the small amount that I've read.

I don't know enough about the general character of the serious MtG market to know how outrageous or not WotC's actions were, so I won't conjecture any further than I've done in this post. I really just wanted to reply on the legal aspect, where (as I've said) I don't know the answer, but I can see how it could be quite a bit more complex than some posters have asserted.

I am going to say one other thing, that is also legally oriented and is striking, and a bit ironic, to me: many of the critics of WotC re the Pinkerton's are also strong advocates of the OGL (and so critics of WotC in relation to that matter too). But for the OGL or for that matter CC, to work, then (to speak roughly) a contract between A and B needs to generate binding consequences between A and C, even though C is not a party to A and B's contract. Which is, at least (very) roughly, the same thing as might be involved in the MtG scenario, where the terms of the distribution contract(s) generate legal consequences for the youtuber despite the latter not being a party to the distribution contract(s).

In other words, I'm not sure that some of WotC's stronger critics have a coherent theory of the private law. To some extent, they seem to approach WotC's conduct as if WotC were a trustee for the public of D&D (and its other IP), rather than a commercial publisher.
 


The situation is more like if you sold your car to a used car dealership, but made them promise to hold it for a week to give you a chance to buy it back. When you come back after 5 days you find they have already sold the car to someone else. They've broken their promise to you, but each transaction was legal and the only way you can get your car back is to hope the new owner is willing to make a deal.
Is this a professional legal opinion? Or conjecture?

What are the terms of the contract? What is the nature of the option it gives you as vendor? What is the law of priorities in the jurisdiction in which the car dealer then makes the subsequent gazumping sale? And what does the gazumping purchaser know about your prior contract?

At least in my jurisdiction (Australia), your description of what the situation is more like is overly simplistic.
 

The situation is more like if you sold your car to a used car dealership, but made them promise to hold it for a week to give you a chance to buy it back. When you come back after 5 days you find they have already sold the car to someone else. They've broken their promise to you, but each transaction was legal and the only way you can get your car back is to hope the new owner is willing to make a deal.

Anyway, to people saying that WotC did nothing wrong, are you forgetting that the Pinkertons threatened to get the police involved? Being arrested and having your home searched is a very traumatic experience even if you know you've done nothing wrong and will be vindicated in the end. This is how they intimidated Dan into giving them his property. You really think this is OK?
At what point did Pinkerton agents threaten police involvement? I don't see any mention of that here.

Edit:

I think you're referring to this?
Cannon describes words used by the agents when they were initially at the door explaining why they were there (as they are required to by law (2020 Sweeney)) and it is likely that they led with the possibilities of criminal activity as part of what they were investigating.
 
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At what point did Pinkerton agents threaten police involvement? I don't see any mention of that here.

Edit:

I think you're referring to this?

There were two videos that I know of that Dan discussed this. As far as I know, these are the only statements Dan made on this. I copied the transcripts to do fact checking, police are not mentioned. He does state in the second video that they [edit: Pinkertons] were being very forceful until he put his foot down. After that they were "kind of chill out after they realized we were not criminals"

I'm not arguing about anything, just posting what Dan actually stated. In any case, the unedited text generated from the videos. Okay, mostly unedited. So many "ums" it was bugging me.

welcome back cardboard workers how's
everybody out there doing today it's
been a crazy month uh it was a really
crazy morning.

I got up and was doing some videos
recording some videos and I did a
recorded a regular March of the machine
collector's box opening before the
events unraveled of the morning so that
may be a little confusing what I'm
saying in that video so take that with a
grain of salt.

I I right after I got done with the
video dogs are barking because
Somebody's knocking at the door uh I
come out and my wife's answering the
door and it was the pinkertons uh if
you're not familiar with the pinkertons
check them out uh yeah it's like kind of
a big deal they're uh they're the
largest private security firm in like
the world I think

the big heavy hitter guys anyway I think
I'm knocking on the door to recover the
stolen product from which is the coast
which was the margin machine aftermath
stuff it wasn't stolen product just to
clear the record as far as I know
nothing was stolen

what I believe happened was the names
are too similar March of the machine
merge the machine aftermath
somebody screwed up and sent out the
wrong cases to the gentleman that I bought the the
boxes off of because when he sold me the
stuff he said he saw me March of the
machine collector's boxes not aftermath uh he's
not a magic guy he's a more Pokemon
Yu-Gi-Oh uh guy I believe uh he just
does magic as because it's all you know
all the card games it just does them all
but he didn't even know what aftermath
really was I don't think

so I don't think he stole anything I
think it was just he got the cases
thinking they were March the machine
some of me thinking they were March the
machine I bought them thinking they were
March of the machine I didn't know until
after I give him the money and opened
the box to look at the the boxes inside
that they were aftermath so because they
still just like say March of the machine
on the outside of the boxes too so I
don't know um I don't want to get too
much into the story the videos are taken
down now

the pinkertons actually gave me the
number to somebody at Wizards of the
Coast that was asking them to have me
call them so I did I called Wizards the
coast and talked to a gentleman there it
was very nice and very apologetic about
making my wife cry first thing in the
morning by sending these uh heavy duty
lawmen I come collect stuff and talk
about stolen products and uh jail time
and all this other stuff but uh they
they don't believe that we stole
anything which we didn't and they don't
believe that I don't know if they
believe anybody really stole anything or
if it was just a an accident or whatever
but they needed the product so they
could try and they wanted the product
back so they could try and figure out
where the the hole was so they can plug
the hole is exactly what his words were
to me and he did apologize and they know
that they they took a lot of stuff that
we had paid a lot of money for and he
actually said they are gonna try and
compensate us a little by sending us
some other product and was asking me
kind of what product I liked and whatnot
so he seemed very nice

which was the coaches not being very
they're not being rude about it or
anything they were being very
and apologizing that they had to go to
drastic means by son the pinkertons on
my front door but

they are uh they are like I said asking
if they can send me some product to make
up for the loss of money so we'll see
what happens with that I'll I'll let you
guys know what happened with it um but
they did seem very nice and very laid
back about the whole thing and they just
wanted the product back so they could
try and figure out where the mistake
happened or if somebody actually did
like you know steal a box off the back of a truck or
something I don't know but I really
don't think that's what happened I think
it's just that the names were too
similar March of the machine marched the
machine aftermath somebody got them mixed up somewhere
along the line and sent out the wrong
boxes to the gentleman that I bought
from and he just wasn't in the know with
magic enough to know that it was the
wrong set so I believe that's really
what happened along the way

I did take the videos down as you've
seen and anybody who's used my footage
uh you'll probably want to take that
down uh it isn't they are saying it is
in some sort of copyright infringement
thing uh so if you've used my footage or got
screenshots with my videos or anything
you probably want to remove that from
your pages or from your sites they did
ask me to ask everybody to take that
down nobody asked my permission to use
my footage or I probably would have told
them you may not want to you know I was
uh you know uploading this stuff because
I had it in my hands but you know I I
really feel that there was no wrongdoing
on my behalf or even the gentleman
perhaps that I got over them I could be
wrong but I really don't think it was
stolen I think it was just a mistake
somewhere along the line

I no longer have the product the
pinkertons took everything to take back
to WotC so they now are in possession
of all the product they counted every
single card and every single booster
pack I don't even have any of the
wrappers or anything like that left they
took the empty boxes the empty packs
everything so I don't even have a token
to show for my for my efforts there but
um it has been a crazy ride the last few
days the Channel's blowing up quite a
bit I got I doubled my subscribers so
welcome everybody new

we'll see it'll probably be a little
less drama going on in the future I hope
uh but I love the game I love the cards
and I just I really like opening boxes and seeing
the cards and it was kind of being a
really old school because I started the
day revise came out it was really nice
to just open boxes and not know what it
was going to be in there like it was in
the old days before the internet before
YouTube we didn't have that stuff in
93-94 when the game came out we just
opened boxes and like oh look at this
new card oh look at that new card and
that was really fun I really missed
those days so it was fun to get to
relive that and actually see a new set
and not know everything about it before
it came out I know I spoiled it for
everybody else but I I really enjoyed
doing that anyways I'm trying to keep
the video short I I don't know what I've
gone over what I haven't gone over could
I recorded this video a few times
obviously because it's hard dick and
know what to say and what not to say in
this type of situation and I'm still
kind of a little flustered about
everything that happened this morning so
uh thank you guys so much for the views
and welcome new subscribers and
hopefully uh in the future things will
go a little smoother
um I don't I've never had to take a
video down before and I have released
stuff pretty early before but this one
obviously there's some extenuating
circumstances I'll let you know if
anything else arises out of that
um but

I don't think anybody did anything wrong
and I don't think Wizards of the Coast
really feels that either uh they just
they're obviously a mistake was made
somewhere along the line and they're
trying to figure out where it was as far
as I know so anyways thank you guys so
much for watching and we'll see you in
the next one uh talk to you later bye

The second video where he talks about this where he's reacting to comments.
everybody that's uh commenting how oh
what a totally kick rocks or whatever
I'm a big history buff and I am very
very familiar with the history of the
pinkertons so the second they said
Pinkerton I kind of my jaw hit the
ground I was like really I guess they
were more mad than I thought they would
be invasion of Fiora
it was intimidating it was a little a
little scary because my wife was also a
history buff and knows about the
pinkertons and some of the uh
uh actions they are taken in the past
uh I won't use the word atrocities even
though that's the first thing that came
to my mind anyways um I won't talk too
much about it a totally Prime Will
Conquer this new flip card there
so you know we immediately knew that
it was pretty serious dudes we were
dealing with and they were very
aggressive at the beginning
they did try and kind of force their way
in a little bit they did not actually
force their way in we didn't put a stop
to that but they were being very forceful at the
beginning and it was very intimidating I did put my
foot down and demanded some respect in my house
and told me he needed to take it back a
notch and he did so they did kind of chill out after they
realized they were not criminals we were
just a couple and I'm just a YouTuber opening
product
 
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