D&D (2024) D&D Monster Manual (2025)

[Echohawk]

WotC ALMOST advanced a metaplot and people were up and arms and it.

Spoiler

"Athas was going to be destroyed in the Spelljammer module and one of the places you visit as it's literally in it's last days. They changed it to Doomspace at the last minute. But we almost had a canon destroyed Dark Sun. Isn't metaplot wonderful? "

I'm mildly confused about why this has spoiler tags, but I hope I'm not the only person who wishes WotC had gone through with this plan. And I say that as a fan of Dark Sun!

 

[mamba]

Weren't the new 2024 PHB races already in the Realms, with Realms lore for them in earlier 5e books?

maybe they just became playable, not sure what 5e book they might have been in though.

I still do not think it matters / anyone but a tiny minority would accept them with a reason but not without one.

I assume there are more people having an issue with these hamfisted changes to bring them into a setting than with just saying ‘they were always there’

 

[dave2008]

I definitely prefer my monster descriptions to be as setting and lore agnostic as possible. I'm good with specific monster lore in specific setting guides, but in the basic MM I just want the stats and a general description. I'll figure out where they fit into my setting. I think the 1e MM handled descriptions well.

I to use the 1e MM & MM2 as my standard for lore; however, some of it definitely pretty setting specific (without actually defining that setting). There is tons of lore in the 1e MM & MM2 that is unique to the "D&D setting." No it may not be specific to any one D&D setting, but it is uniquely D&D.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

I'm mildly confused about why this has spoiler tags, but I hope I'm not the only person who wishes WotC had gone through with this plan. And I say that as a fan of Dark Sun!

No, me too. It's the one bit of metaplot I was completely in favour of.

 

[dave2008]

Not that these approaches are mutually exclusive, of course. A moving timeline can still introduce new ideas by just having them "offstage" until now (such as the aforementioned Blood War in 2e; I also don't recall 3e officially explaining why dwarves on Oerth could suddenly become wizards). And a frozen timeline can still indulge in explanations (Eberron's cosmology being integrated into 5e's larger cosmology, but separate due to the Ring of Siberys).

Just wanted to point out that Eberron being part of the wider D&D cosmology existed from the beginning according to Keith. It is not mentioned a lot, but Eberron has always been a part of the larger D&D cosmology, it did not start with 5e.

 

[dave2008]

I'm mildly confused about why this has spoiler tags, but I hope I'm not the only person who wishes WotC had gone through with this plan. And I say that as a fan of Dark Sun!

Why do you wish they had destroyed Dark Sun?

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Weren't the new 2024 PHB races already in the Realms, with Realms lore for them in earlier 5e books? Unless you're referring to the lore changes they received. In which case, we haven't seen how the 2025 Realms books will treat the new versions. (Or how the 2025 Realms books will treat the setting's long history in general.)

Goliaths where kind of added in 4e, and there are a couple of goliath settlements detailed in 5e Rime of the Frostmaiden. But these have now been revealed to be stone giant goliaths. The fire, frost, hill and storm giant goliaths are completely new to the Forgotten Realms (and everywhere else).

Aasimar have been around as a minor option for yonks, probably first appeared mid 2e.

 

[Paul Farquhar]

Why do you wish they had destroyed Dark Sun?

A) because it's a narratively appropriate end. It was going on about how doomed Athas was from the start. So prove it. No last minute get out of gaol free cards.

B) It leaves the path open for a new "Dark Sun" on a different world that could be more appropriate to current values (and game mechanics).

 

[Remathilis]

I'm mildly confused about why this has spoiler tags, but I hope I'm not the only person who wishes WotC had gone through with this plan. And I say that as a fan of Dark Sun!

For people who don't want to know about the SJ module. I had to redo the post due to messing up the tags and the spoilers for the module plot got lost in the redo.

 

[dave2008]

A) because it's a narratively appropriate end. It was going on about how doomed Athas was from the start. So prove it. No last minute get out of gaol free cards.

I can see that, but being sucked into a black hole didn't seem to be the most thematically appropriate ending to me (however I am not intimately familiar with the setting).

B) It leaves the path open for a new "Dark Sun" on a different world that could be more appropriate to current values (and game mechanics).

I guess my preference would be to reset the setting back to the original timeline and make the changes you feel appropriate, rather than have a new quasi-Dark Sun setting with the names filed off. But to each their own.