God Rules: Players Guide (5e)

[Khisanth the Ancient]

Yes the tiering nomenclature is a bit 'wibbly-wobbly' at the moment. Basically the 9th dimension is a Hyperverse, but has the Supernals. While the 6th dimension currently has Hypereals and also the adjacent Interdimensional Space (ie. Hyperspace).

Technically the 10th dimension is Outerversal (for those who know their scaling...if you know, you know), but the "Outer Gods" are the Sidereal gods of the Far Realm which is the 5th-dimension.

Trying to create an "Oververse" that fits EVERY conceivable source (comics, manga, RPG, Lovecraft, tv, sci-fi, SCPs etc.) so you can just slot in: "I want to use this DC villain" or "I want this Dragonball character" or "I want this Lovecraft entity" etc. ...and just drop them in because the tiering is pretty obvious.

Sounds cool! I don't know what an Outerverse is though.

Hmm, so if the Far Realm is 5th dimension (when it was 7th in Ascension/Epic Bestiary) and Interdimensional Space is 6th (when it was Nth in Ascension/Epic Bestiary), have the Inner and Outer Planes stopped being dimensions?

So it's like 0 = entropy/null, 1-3 = regular space, 4 = time (are the Transitive Planes still linked to the 4th dimension?), 5 = Far Realm, 6 = interdimensional space, 7-8 = ?, 9 = Hyperverse, 10 = Outerverse?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Sounds cool! I don't know what an Outerverse is though.

It's a 'scaler's' term (YouTube "Outerversal" and there will be dozens of videos). It's used for versus battles.

Unfortunately they often use potential hyperbole as evidence and they end up with skewed results like "Dr Strange is Outerversal". Then again, such stories are rarely consistent. I prefer it all to make sense though.

Hmm, so if the Far Realm is 5th dimension (when it was 7th in Ascension/Epic Bestiary) and Interdimensional Space is 6th (when it was Nth in Ascension/Epic Bestiary), have the Inner and Outer Planes stopped being dimensions?
So it's like 0 = entropy/null, 1-3 = regular space, 4 = time (are the Transitive Planes still linked to the 4th dimension?), 5 = Far Realm, 6 = interdimensional space, 7-8 = ?, 9 = Hyperverse, 10 = Outerverse?

I have changed things quite a bit (for the better...in my opinion at least).

Now everything is dimensions of consciousness with the occasional spatial overlap. With each dimension split along a chaos/law divide.

ie. The second dimension is Ethereal Space, with the Feywild and Shadowfell (also known as Fairyland and the Underworld).

So indirectly each higher dimension operates as a new "difficulty level", but has enough of a spread so that places like the Far Realm are available for brief visits at the epic tier. Hopefully aiding Games Masters plan things out.

 

[FleshEatingBlackFlutterby]

Howdy amigo!



Well off the top of my head...approx. 100 Epic spells, approx. 100 Artifacts (relatively easy conversion), Divine Realm building, 30+ new Materials, multiple new dimensions...but I am sure there is a lot more than that.



I do currently have (Epic) Spell Conversion notes in the book for 1st/2nd (Karsus Avatar and so forth) & 3rd (Epic Level Handbook spells).

So there is approx. a hundred new epic spells that can immediately have the DC converted in a few seconds.

I was planning to do full conversion notes on the website. Looking at the basic immortals, divine status is more or less the same up to Old One rank.

Hit Dice are (approx.) double the minimum I had in 3E (though Max. HP no longer comes as standard).

But after Old One there are a lot of new ranks and tiers...to better fit the new dimensions.

Sounds fun.

Double the minimum HD actually makes sense to me. It would push epic play out further in a good way.

What will the godly realm rules be like? Will they bear any similarity to Deities and Demigods rules?

 

[Upper_Krust]

Sounds fun.

I hope people will like it.

Double the minimum HD actually makes sense to me. It would push epic play out further in a good way.

I think Hit Point totals are less on average because d20 Hit Dice and Maximum HP are not standard issue.

It didn't make sense for existing immortal beings (like Orcus) to use one set of rules and my immortals to use another. Plus I also wanted Warrior gods to have more Hit Points than Spell-caster Gods. So you just keep your class Hit Dice or size Hit Dice (if you have no Class).

What will the godly realm rules be like? Will they bear any similarity to Deities and Demigods rules?

The size might be similar (been a while sine I checked) but the mechanics are different. I think D&Dg (3E) spent a lot of time on how immortals can change the weather and the direction of gravity (IIRC). But these things do not really impact epic level visitors to a large degree.

So I have concentrated on the Traits that DO matter to visitors and let immortals manipulate energy sources or creature features and so forth. They have greater control within their Fortress, then Lair Actions in their "Throne Room".

The number of manipulations are limited, but you can make each realm feel different pretty easily.

Then you also have Fortress materials and special Energy Type ballista and some other stuff.

Its pretty cool.

I'll keep tweaking things up to release.

 

[Khisanth the Ancient]

I have changed things quite a bit (for the better...in my opinion at least).

Now everything is dimensions of consciousness with the occasional spatial overlap. With each dimension split along a chaos/law divide.

ie. The second dimension is Ethereal Space, with the Feywild and Shadowfell (also known as Fairyland and the Underworld).

So indirectly each higher dimension operates as a new "difficulty level", but has enough of a spread so that places like the Far Realm are available for brief visits at the epic tier. Hopefully aiding Games Masters plan things out.

Huh, cool! I am not sure I understand "dimensions of consciousness", but I'm sure it will make sense in the book.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey Khisanth buddy!

Huh, cool! I am not sure I understand "dimensions of consciousness", but I'm sure it will make sense in the book.

Its a higher dimension you can perceive and interact with.

1. Prime Material Plane
2. Ethereal (with Feywild/Fairyland and Shadowfell/Underworld)
3. Astral (with Elemental Chaos & Astral Sea...or alternately the Great Wheel if you want that)
etc. up to 9 detailed (with 10-12 a bit metaphysical/Information Space/Noosphere)

Basically gives GMs and Players an easier way to progress.

In 3rd Edition I had the 'lower dimensions' all basically equal in power. But now its more like a set of stairs and each dimension has its own 'gods' and multiple different factions, each is split along a law vs chaos axis.

 

[Upper_Krust]

Hey all!

Posting this here (rather than the Immortals Handbook 5E Player's Guide thread) because:

A: GOD RULES is the "brand name" for the 5e Epic/Immortal rules, not Immortal's Handbook
B. I think the previews in that thread were from several years ago and have zero relevance to the current layout or art, so if anything showing that is maybe hurting the new book.

Anyway, the reason for this post is just to say I'll probably just go with the Drivethrurpg route rather than the Kickstarter route for the release of the GOD RULES - Player's Guide and the GOD RULES - Epic Bestiary: Primer. I've weighed things up and I am not sure if the benefits of a Kickstarter will outweigh the hassle of all the trappings of getting it set up - especially with me having to do all that myself.

The two problems I have with Drivethrurpg is first and foremost that the (standard) print version of the book does not have gloss/silk pages - which is really needed to pick out the gold highlights on tables and so forth. The second problem is that I wanted to have something (its a surprise - you'll love it) on the inside of front and back covers and I don't think Drivethru can do that.

Drivethrurpg does have a "Premium" option with 'Silky' pages, however, the print cost is a bit crazy and I am still not convinced the quality will warrant the crazy price (though when I get everything finished I will order* a copy of the standard and premium versions and see what the differences are.

*This is mandatory before they allow the books ready for customers.

If I feel the Premium version does not warrant the extra $35 price tag, I might nix it and print off a few "Special Edition" versions myself. But I am not sure how many people would be interested, so its tough to gauge whether I'll need 10 special edition copies or more. Plus not sure really low print runs can pick options like gilded page edges and so forth.

As of right now I'm thinking the pricing will be:

GOD RULES - Player's Guide (400 page PDF) = $34.99
GOD RULES - Player's Guide (400 page PDF + Standard Colour Hardcover version) = $64.99
GOD RULES - Player's Guide (400 page PDF + Premium Colour Hardcover version) = $99.99
Just to clarify the above prices are me making the same profit (give or take one dollar) on each version, so don't feel the need to specifically get the Premium version to support me - I actually make the least profit on the Premium version.

If I was to go with a Fulfillment route (for a Print Version) then to make things profitable, I need to print 750 copies (or more); which seems an unlikely target even with a Kickstarter. But at that point I could just charge $65 for the ridiculously high quality book version, plus I wouldn't have to give Drivethru their cut so I'd actually end up making more per copy but the caveat is I need to spend $20k up front and I don't see a penny of profit until I sell 300 copies.

So just to circle back, I'll be going with the Drivethru RPG route for at least the GOD RULES - Player's Guide and the GOD RULES - Epic Bestiary: Primer. If the sales are decent enough I can maybe take a gamble with later releases such as the 400 page GOD RULES - Epic Bestiary: Planes of Chaos with the Challenge Ratings from 12-120+ and go the Fulfillment route, but that is only beneficial when I know I can definitely sell 750+ copies (which seems very ambitious to me) of the print versions and I won't know that until a while after the Drivethru RPG version is on sale.

 

[dave2008]

Hey all!

Posting this here (rather than the Immortals Handbook 5E Player's Guide thread) because:

A: GOD RULES is the "brand name" for the 5e Epic/Immortal rules, not Immortal's Handbook
B. I think the previews in that thread were from several years ago and have zero relevance to the current layout or art, so if anything showing that is maybe hurting the new book.

Anyway, the reason for this post is just to say I'll probably just go with the Drivethrurpg route rather than the Kickstarter route for the release of the GOD RULES - Player's Guide and the GOD RULES - Epic Bestiary: Primer. I've weighed things up and I am not sure if the benefits of a Kickstarter will outweigh the hassle of all the trappings of getting it set up - especially with me having to do all that myself.

The two problems I have with Drivethrurpg is first and foremost that the (standard) print version of the book does not have gloss/silk pages - which is really needed to pick out the gold highlights on tables and so forth. The second problem is that I wanted to have something (its a surprise - you'll love it) on the inside of front and back covers and I don't think Drivethru can do that.

Drivethrurpg does have a "Premium" option with 'Silky' pages, however, the print cost is a bit crazy and I am still not convinced the quality will warrant the crazy price (though when I get everything finished I will order* a copy of the standard and premium versions and see what the differences are.

*This is mandatory before they allow the books ready for customers.

If I feel the Premium version does not warrant the extra $35 price tag, I might nix it and print off a few "Special Edition" versions myself. But I am not sure how many people would be interested, so its tough to gauge whether I'll need 10 special edition copies or more. Plus not sure really low print runs can pick options like gilded page edges and so forth.

As of right now I'm thinking the pricing will be:

GOD RULES - Player's Guide (400 page PDF) = $34.99
GOD RULES - Player's Guide (400 page PDF + Standard Colour Hardcover version) = $64.99
GOD RULES - Player's Guide (400 page PDF + Premium Colour Hardcover version) = $99.99
Just to clarify the above prices are me making the same profit (give or take one dollar) on each version, so don't feel the need to specifically get the Premium version to support me - I actually make the least profit on the Premium version.

If I was to go with a Fulfillment route (for a Print Version) then to make things profitable, I need to print 750 copies (or more); which seems an unlikely target even with a Kickstarter. But at that point I could just charge $65 for the ridiculously high quality book version, plus I wouldn't have to give Drivethru their cut so I'd actually end up making more per copy but the caveat is I need to spend $20k up front and I don't see a penny of profit until I sell 300 copies.

So just to circle back, I'll be going with the Drivethru RPG route for at least the GOD RULES - Player's Guide and the GOD RULES - Epic Bestiary: Primer. If the sales are decent enough I can maybe take a gamble with later releases such as the 400 page GOD RULES - Epic Bestiary: Planes of Chaos with the Challenge Ratings from 12-120+ and go the Fulfillment route, but that is only beneficial when I know I can definitely sell 750+ copies (which seems very ambitious to me) of the print versions and I won't know that until a while after the Drivethru RPG version is on sale.

I am a bit confused here. Why not go with Kickstarter and use Drivethru for the POD? Kickstarter basically has built in marketing as people will just peruse KS to see what new projects are available. Additionally, this very website has a weekly column about crowdfunding (Crowdfunding News) that gets at least 2,000 views every week. I am sure if you drop Egg a note he will put you in his column. I really think you are likely to get more sales with a KS campaign and you could always make a print run (special edition or otherwise) a stretch goal. I know Morrus will only use crowdfunding for EnWorld projects now because there are many benefits.

Also, if setting up the KS is an issue for you, I am sure we can get you some help with that. The last update I saw has the book coming out in 2+ months. That is plenty of time to put together a KS page. Heck, that is a marketing tool in itself. You set up a KS page and let people "follow" it before the release of the KS and the number of followers is a good predictor of success. It could even help inform your printing decisions.

 

[Upper_Krust]

I am a bit confused here. Why not go with Kickstarter and use Drivethru for the POD? Kickstarter basically has built in marketing as people will just peruse KS to see what new projects are available. Additionally, this very website has a weekly column about crowdfunding (Crowdfunding News) that gets at least 2,000 views every week. I am sure if you drop Egg a note he will put you in his column. I really think you are likely to get more sales with a KS campaign and you could always make a print run (special edition or otherwise) a stretch goal. I know Morrus will only use crowdfunding for EnWorld projects now because there are many benefits.

Maybe that is the best way to go about it.

At the moment Kickstarter just has that unknown factor, which is putting me off at a time when I don't know what the sales will be. I was just thinking when I see the Drivethrurpg sales for this book I will have a good idea what the sales for future books will be.

Presumably it would boost sales to the point where it would offset their taking 10% off the top...?

Also, if setting up the KS is an issue for you, I am sure we can get you some help with that. The last update I saw has the book coming out in 2+ months. That is plenty of time to put together a KS page. Heck, that is a marketing tool in itself. You set up a KS page and let people "follow" it before the release of the KS and the number of followers is a good predictor of success. It could even help inform your printing decisions.

I would likely need a hand with a bunch of stuff (at least this first time).

 

[dave2008]

I would likely need a hand with a bunch of stuff (at least this first time).

Let me get through the holidays and I will see how I can help. I have run one successful KS, so I have some insight. I have some ideas to help drive sales based on my KS and my experience with KS purchases.