D&D (2024) Wrapping up first 2-20 2024 campaign this week, some of my thoughts

[Mort]

I agree, but just a note. Surprise has been nerfed a bit in the 2024 rules, all it means now is that those creatures surprised have disadvantage on initiative.

It's actually been nerfed a lot!

2024 surprise just means surprised PCs/foes are likely to to go later in the round. 2014 surprise meant they wouldn't get to go at all the first round, meaning anyone with high initiative would likely go twice before the surprised party could go at all.

As importantly 2024 surprise doesn't affect reactions. 2014 version means you don't get reactions on the first turn of combat, so no shield, endure elements, opportunity attacks etc.

 

[Oofta]

Oh I agree! That wasn't what was suggested though.

I must say that, unless you're mostly running for three-player parties, I am skeptical that this is literally true. Because I've seen plenty of Hard encounters get one-rounded, from both sides of the table. You have to get into Extreme before you start literally never seeing one-round stuff with "normal" size parties (i.e. 4-5 PCs) in my experience (this is including adjustments for party size note, which don't actually account for the capabilities of PCs very well).

I mean, I don't run encounters I can justify RP-wise, and I think I'd have to work incredibly hard to RP-justify 4 Beholders. I'm not saying its impossible or something but I think a lot of DMs prefer to run stuff that feels natural to them, which can run into conflict with how wild PCs can get at higher levels.

For the most part I've had a hard time keeping the size of the group down to 6. As far as 1 round combats? I just double checked with my wife, she can't remember any either. The only exception (and she was speculating because she couldn't remember one) would have been at level 1 or 2 where the group won initiative. Which could make sense because it wasn't supposed to be a difficult fight in any case. But after the first few levels? neither one of us could think of a single example.

As far as the 4 beholders, no I've never done that and probably wouldn't. On the other hand a necromancer beholder with multiple undead beholders made from the corpses of slain enemies? That could be an interesting encounter.

 

[Mort]

As far as the 4 beholders, no I've never done that and probably wouldn't. On the other hand a necromancer beholder with multiple undead beholders made from the corpses of slain enemies? That could be an interesting encounter.

I know you don't use published adventures, but if you want to yoink a fun beholder scenario, take a look at the final encounter in Turn of the Fortunes Wheel (the 5e Planescape adventure).

It's set in the realm of a beholder god, with much of what that implies. The god even taunts the PCs as they're trying to navigate the realm with stuff like “Cast away your disgusting limbs! Embrace Gzemnid’s globular perfection!”

 

[mamba]

the players are running roughshod over this DM, not just in this adventure, but in EVERY SINGLE adventure for the past six campaigns.

and yet they felt it was noticeably easier this time, and the only thing that changed was the rules from 2014 to 2024…

 

[Oofta]

I know you don't use published adventures, but if you want to yoink a fun beholder scenario, take a look at the final encounter in Turn of the Fortunes Wheel (the 5e Planescape adventure).

It's set in the realm of a beholder god, with much of what that implies. The god even taunts the PCs as they're trying to navigate the realm with stuff like “Cast away your disgusting limbs! Embrace Gzemnid’s globular perfection!”

Maybe when we get a higher level I'll have to check it out. I occasionally buy mods just to pull fun parts out.

 

[mamba]

It's odd that there are lamentations about how broken the game is now with the new rules but somehow imposing limitations or adding in a few house rules seems to be out of the question.

I don’t think it is out of the question, the OP even suggested some. The issue is that they are needed to turn it into a viable game, and moreso in 2024

 

[Swarmkeeper]

A couple of questions for @ECMO3

• how often has the party taken a short or long rest?
• at end of session, are PCs brought to full health and spell slots? (Or, to put this another way, how often is a long rest granted between sessions?)
• at level up, do PCs get the benefit of a long rest? (I suppose, given the fast leveling schedule, this is mostly the same question as the previous one)

 

[Mort]

and yet they felt it was noticeably easier this time, and the only thing that changed was the rules from 2014 to 2024…

2024 martials got a pretty big boost across the board, especially the fighter and the monk. Casters didn't get as big a boost, but they certainly didn't get nerfed.

IMO, I like the changes. But it means you have to buff up the encounters too, or, yeah, running them over seems even more likely.

 

[TwoSix]

And the whole "no-one else is getting results like this" is frankly, hogwash, because how many other groups are we seeing who have actually done 2-20 on D&D 2024? List them. It's not going to be many. I haven't heard of anyone doing much more than 2-8 yet, and those ones had similar issues to what is being described at lower levels.

Agreed. @ECMO3 is the only poster on this board I know of whose group plays regularly and really stress-tests the system by focusing on completing modules quickly. Are their experiences going to be idiosyncratic? Of course! Hardly anyone else is doing that. But that's exactly what makes the data @ECMO3 is providing so valuable.

 

[Oofta]

I don’t think it is out of the question, the OP even suggested some. The issue is that they are needed to turn it into a viable game, and moreso in 2024

I don't think you need any house rules. But I do think if you allow people to load up with things like 10 rare rings and everyone having legendary items that the DM needs to rethink how many magic items are available or adjust encounter difficulty to compensate. There are multiple ways to fix the obvious issues but that requires admitting at least partial responsibility on the part of the DM.

There have certainly been times when I overestimated how difficult an encounter would be but the solution is not to blame the system and pretend that as a DM I had no part in it.