D&D (2024) Martial/Caster fix.

[Ashrym]

It's listed as a component in the 2014 version

Which was replaced by the 2024 version.

 

[Zardnaar]

Which was replaced by the 2024 version.

It's not guaranteed a DM is using 2024.

A lot of ENworlds is not playing 5.5. It's probably a safe assumption more people are playing 2014.

 

[Ashrym]

It's nit guaranteed a DM is using 2024.

A lotion ENworlds is not. It's probably a safe assumption more people are playing 2014.

This thread is tagged D&D2024. Why wouldn't we be using 2024 rules?

 

[Chaltab]

Which was replaced by the 2024 version.

I was just noting that this is a specific change.

 

[Distracted DM]

I was just noting that this is a specific change.

I appreciated it, I only checked the 2024 version and I forget that there are significant changes between 5e14 and 5e24 (I use A5E).

 

[Clint_L]

I'm not saying that we need those martials to have exactly spells like blindness or whatever. I'm saying that the whole system is full of stuff that simply isn't available to martials at all.

I'm not even saying that everyone needs access to everything. That's jut a strawman...

But I'll throw that strawman right back at you:

You are saying that no one needs access to everything, but it is pretty much the case that many casters have access to everything already, and martials don't. Consider something like the bladesinger. Clearly those things are then badly designed, since you agree that no one should have access to everything.

So…to cite an example of a caster doing martial stuff, you cite a subclass. If only martial classes also had subclasses for players interested in adding some casting. Or half caster classes, like one that blends holy magic with martial abilities. Or feats. Or magic items. Or the ability to multiclass.

It’s too bad 5e doesn’t offer any way to customize martial classes.

 

[Clint_L]

Didn’t we see a million versions of this thread before martial classes all got massively buffed? What is the end game, here? A fighter who can do the best DPR and the best mitigation and the most versatility in combat and handle all the social interactions and be the explorer?

No, then we’d get threads complaining that fighters don’t also get the wish spell.

Though I expect that in a year or so, once more folk who post here have actually played the 2024 rules, we’ll see a proliferation of “buff casters/nerf martials threads. Especially given that almost all games happen at low-mid levels, where martial classes dominate.

 

[Ashrym]

So…to cite an example of a caster doing martial stuff, you cite a subclass. If only martial classes also had subclasses for players interested in adding some casting. Or half caster classes, like one that blends holy magic with martial abilities. Or feats. Or magic items. Or the ability to multiclass.

It’s too bad 5e doesn’t offer any way to customize martial classes.

The funny thing is there are options in the martial classes to do more than some of the posts seem to imply. A question in one of the threads (I forget which was) party A (barbarian, fighter, monk, rogue) or party B (cleric, druid, sorcerer, wizard) to blindly go into a 10th level dungeon.

I think a world tree barbarian, champion fighter, way of mercy monk, and assassin rogue would do just fine.

The barbarian can give out a lot of thp and teleport ppl around the local battle.
The fighter at that level eats through heroic inspiration like pez candy.
The monk can heal.
The assassin was just because they also have advantage on initiative like the barbarian and champion fighter. Soulknife was also a consideration and Thief (for fast hands).

There are abilities in the martial classes that can do interesting things beyond hitting things and getting hit by things.

 

[CreamCloud0]

The funny thing is there are options in the martial classes to do more than some of the posts seem to imply. A question in one of the threads (I forget which was) party A (barbarian, fighter, monk, rogue) or party B (cleric, druid, sorcerer, wizard) to blindly go into a 10th level dungeon.

I think a world tree barbarian, champion fighter, way of mercy monk, and assassin rogue would do just fine.

The barbarian can give out a lot of thp and teleport ppl around the local battle.
The fighter at that level eats through heroic inspiration like pez candy.
The monk can heal.
The assassin was just because they also have advantage on initiative like the barbarian and champion fighter. Soulknife was also a consideration and Thief (for fast hands).

There are abilities in the martial classes that can do interesting things beyond hitting things and getting hit by things.

it's not really a question of if the martial party 'would do just fine' though, it's which party would be more apt to face the adventure blind, the casters get their subclassess too y'know?, i struggle to imagine that a party with a war cleric, moon druid, clockwork sorcerer and diviner wizard couldn't match the martials and beat the adventure more easily, they might not match for DRP but when you've got another healer, spiritual weapon, wildshape, haste, bless, web, hypnotic pattern, polymorph, fly, entangle and more, the martials might have higher DPR, but the casters have far greater ability to multiply their chances to deal damage as well as mitigate, reduce and recover the damage they do take.

 

[GrimCo]

Martials got buffed, sure. But they are still mostly single target dpr and still lack ability to aggro. I'll admit, haven't memorised all the changes that was made in 2024 revision, but if they can do AoE or hit multiple targets that aren't around them or they have abilities to force opponents to attack them, cool. That's what they lacked in 2014 version.