D&D General The First Demise of TSR: Gygax's Folly

[Dioltach]

Yeah, "nepotism" isn't quite the correct term, but it's close enough for me. Instead of promoting a family member, Williams "promoted" an IP owned by the family.

It happens all the time in the corporate world. "We need an X type product, which sister company A makes. So even if it's not the best one on the market. we'll use it." It's a form of synergy.

 

[MGibster]

It really wasn't. Having the company you own publish games and books based on IP you own is not nepotism.

I'll be honest with you, I always looked at TSR as a publicly traded company under Williams' leadership but you and others have since reminded me that it wasn't. As such, I can't even question whether it was ethical for her to try to produce a Buck Rogers game. She owned TSR as was well within her rights to direct the company as she saw fit.

 

[Dire Bare]

I'll be honest with you, I always looked at TSR as a publicly traded company under Williams' leadership but you and others have since reminded me that it wasn't. As such, I can't even question whether it was ethical for her to try to produce a Buck Rogers game. She owned TSR as was well within her rights to direct the company as she saw fit.

Good point. I've also "judged" Williams' decisions as if TSR was publically traded. Doesn't really change my opinion much, but you're correct, she was well within her legal and ethical rights to push Buck Rogers.

And we got some good products out of it! Wish we could get digital PDFs (legally) of the 25th Century RPG!

 

[Mournblade94]

Good point. I've also "judged" Williams' decisions as if TSR was publically traded. Doesn't really change my opinion much, but you're correct, she was well within her legal and ethical rights to push Buck Rogers.

And we got some good products out of it! Wish we could get digital PDFs (legally) of the 25th Century RPG!

Unfortunately I never got to play it but I had that and some of the supplements. They were good reading.

 

[Warpiglet-7]

A weird thing buck rogers…

I bought buck rogers battle gor
The 25th century in the cheap at KMart…

It basically got my group into plastic dudes on a map and was the gateway to axis and allies and shogun.

My friend just had the buck rogers map blown up and is playing anew…

I associated with the Gil Gerard sp? tv show…later realizing how old the property was…

Weird historical turning point for my gaming group of all things.

 

[Sacrosanct]

And we got some good products out of it!

Darn right we did. One of my all time favorite TSR product was the Core Rules CD ROM. It's extra sad that horrible management ruined that as well (read up on the Babbages debacle).

 

[Mournblade94]

Darn right we did. One of my all time favorite TSR product was the Core Rules CD ROM. It's extra sad that horrible management ruined that as well (read up on the Babbages debacle).

Lol Babbages. That's a name I've not heard for a long time.

 

[Mournblade94]

A weird thing buck rogers…

I bought buck rogers battle gor
The 25th century in the cheap at KMart…

It basically got my group into plastic dudes on a map and was the gateway to axis and allies and shogun.

My friend just had the buck rogers map blown up and is playing anew…

I associated with the Gil Gerard sp? tv show…later realizing how old the property was…

Weird historical turning point for my gaming group of all things.

Noble Knight has this unpunched for $130 or so.

Buck Rogers - Battle for the 25th Century - Boardgame - TSR from TSR

The World's Largest Selection of tabletop games!

www.nobleknight.com

They also have a lot of the TSR BR Comics (Totally forgot about those).

Another problem with TSR evident right there. Self publishing those comics. Sheer speculation: I'm imagining DC not wanting to.licencd them (they were publishing D&D and Forgotten Realms comics) so TSR went ahead and did it. Needlepoint lesson never learned.

 

[numtini]

I think as a society we suffer too much from “great man theory”.

A lot of people brought their own creativity to make D&D, including Gygax.

Also, Mr. Gygax was not really a fan of the creativity of the community's creativity. He begrudgingly accepted non-humans, but he got downright vicious about the concept of a critical hit or non-Vancian magic (ie, spell points) and quite nasty to the people experimenting with them.

 

[Some Dude]

There was certainly malice, at least by some. See the "Castle Greyhawk" parody adventure.

I'm not sure it was malice so much as a move away from dungeon delving and the wargamer-level detail that Gygax liked to put into products. I have trouble believing that, given the resources involved, it was pure spite. The City of Greyhawk boxed set came about a year later, and that is one of the best city supplements ever made for D&D.

IME, it's more likely that someone thought a collection of parody adventures would work, they needed to attach it to a setting, and Greyhawk ended up with it by default. The Realms already had a full schedule and pop culture humor makes even less sense for Dragonlance (still no overall sense for any setting, IMO).

WG7 Castle Greyhawk is a better adventure than it gets credit for, though it's a terrible "Greyhawk" adventure. There's a veritable who's who of RPG talent involved. And though the whole may be less than the sum of the parts, I think this would have been more highly regarded if it hadn't been a "Greyhawk" adventure in name.

That having been said, the part with Mordenkainen trying to make a movie and being in a hot tub with his secretary is clearly a dig at Gygax.

Gygax shafted Arneson out of monies due. Arneson took him to court and won.

TSR settled. Sure, Arneson probably would have won, but technically he didn't.