3PP Release The Night of the Knife: A Campaign Quartet Adventure

1st of all congratulations on another succesful release. As with your previous releases I really enjoy your takes on the certain classes and the fantasies that they might offer and again these new quartet is no different. I have a question tho unless Im missing something the inquisitor class gets too many spell slots like even more than full casters(of course they dont get acess to 8th and up but still) So my question is was this a design choice or is there a mistake?
You ever follow a pattern and it's a simplistic pattern and you continue following the pattern after the point where the pattern ends and wind up with a sweater with a 5ft long right arm and not enough yarn to finish the rest of the sweater?

... I'll fix it. I'm shocked no one else noticed, before now! Thank you!
 
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You ever follow a pattern and it's a simplistic pattern and you continue following the pattern after the point where the pattern ends and wind up with a sweater with a 5ft long right arm and not enough yarn to finish the rest of the sweater?

... I'll fix it. I'm shocked no one else noticed, before now! Thank you!
Cant relate dexterity is my dump stat I wouldnt be able to work with yarn if I tried. Saying that the analogy is not lost on me and since I finished reading the entire thing I can easily say that this is as expected another winner. Also keeper might be my favorite class like maybe ever I always wanted to play a snarky naughty word john constantine type character the closest I got was investigator from mage hand press which is a fine class in itself but it always to me lacked certain things in the way it works mainly just using rituals and no quick thinking on your feet and getting a stupid whatever magic to keep yourself in the game like constantine does,keeper tho seems extremely cool. Also any reason why you chose to make slayers exclusively single combat tradition style character?
 

Cant relate dexterity is my dump stat I wouldnt be able to work with yarn if I tried. Saying that the analogy is not lost on me and since I finished reading the entire thing I can easily say that this is as expected another winner. Also keeper might be my favorite class like maybe ever I always wanted to play a snarky naughty word john constantine type character the closest I got was investigator from mage hand press which is a fine class in itself but it always to me lacked certain things in the way it works mainly just using rituals and no quick thinking on your feet and getting a stupid whatever magic to keep yourself in the game like constantine does,keeper tho seems extremely cool. Also any reason why you chose to make slayers exclusively single combat tradition style character?
To really drive home the single minded nature of the class concept/fantasy. This is "I will hunt you down and kill you" class. They don't take a ton of time training in a bunch of different styles, they just master -one- and make it work for them in every situation. Slayer's Defense and Weapon Style are the same thing. If you want a fencer and archer you go Deft and your Longbow deals 1d10 instead of 1d8, and so does your rapier. You're all in on -just- that.

Mighty Style? Thrown Weapons hit hard enough to compete with a longbow, so you'll generally use those instead of relying on your Dex mod, even though the range shrinks a bit.

But it also plays into the First Impressions and that specific narrative identity. I really wanted Master of the Form to be a powerful, notable, thing within the world. Where you are seen as one of the wandering masters of your specific style. The kind of thing where two masters of different styles meet in the world and do the "Which Style is Better" fight that you get in some kung-fu movies, like Kung-Fu Hustle's awesome three way fight between the poor masters living in the tenements, unaware that the landlady and her husband are, also, masters of legendary styles!

Things like that.
 

Just wondering... do pregen sheets for the 4 characters on the cover already exist?

Also, has anyone already compiled "care packages" for players already? I might just compile a larger pdf document with the class and all other rules the player could need (like spells/combat maneuvers/...) to create a character in the adventure.

Hoping that others post their group compositions here...
 

Just wondering... do pregen sheets for the 4 characters on the cover already exist?

Also, has anyone already compiled "care packages" for players already? I might just compile a larger pdf document with the class and all other rules the player could need (like spells/combat maneuvers/...) to create a character in the adventure.

Hoping that others post their group compositions here...
I've got some Pregen Sheets I'm working on, yes. I just added the maps and tokens pack to DTRPG.com for download, too!
 

i will say, the classes seem very strong. they all get a lot of skills (the inquisitor and slayer get FIVE, which is crazy because that's more then a rogue), and the inquisitor gets extra attack AND sneak attack-esque radiant damage AND up to 7th level spells. i think other then skills the other classes are fine, but i wonder if inquisitor might be a tad overtuned. i guess castigation is supposed to be balanced by not being able to castigate certain creature types, but that feels more like the class is neutered if you're fighting those enemies. i wonder if it'd be more balanced if you could either castigate OR use extra attack? that way castigate is your main since it does more damage and fuels your judgement pool, but extra attack is there as a fall back if you're fighting something you can't castigate. this is just a first impression, though, so maybe it all works better in actual play.

also it's weird that castigation doesn't work with ranged weapons yet the inquisitor iconic has a pistol.
 

i will say, the classes seem very strong. they all get a lot of skills (the inquisitor and slayer get FIVE, which is crazy because that's more then a rogue), and the inquisitor gets extra attack AND sneak attack-esque radiant damage AND up to 7th level spells. i think other then skills the other classes are fine, but i wonder if inquisitor might be a tad overtuned. i guess castigation is supposed to be balanced by not being able to castigate certain creature types, but that feels more like the class is neutered if you're fighting those enemies. i wonder if it'd be more balanced if you could either castigate OR use extra attack? that way castigate is your main since it does more damage and fuels your judgement pool, but extra attack is there as a fall back if you're fighting something you can't castigate. this is just a first impression, though, so maybe it all works better in actual play.

also it's weird that castigation doesn't work with ranged weapons yet the inquisitor iconic has a pistol.
So... the Inquisitor's Castigation:

Yeah, it's like sneak attack damage. And at level 1, it's the same level as a sneak attack, but you can apply it more liberally at that level range and don't need to rely on enemy positioning or advantage. But it also starts falling behind at 3rd level, and you need a bonus action to perform your Absolvement, meaning your option for off-hand attacks as a fallback for rounds where you miss your one attack is less of an option. (Not not an option, just less of one)

By level 5 you're dropping 1d8+3d6+Dex as a rogue and 1d8+2d6+Dex as an Inquisitor. To offset the throughput difference, you get an extra attack which also offsets the unavailability of bonus action striking as a fallback for missing and skipping out on damage for the round. Which puts the throughput to 1d8+4d6+Dex for Rogue and 2d8+2d6+(Dex(2)) for an Inquisitor. But your healing pull is still capped at (1d8+2d6+Dex)/2. So it kinda works out.

However, the gap widens continually across all following levels. Yeah, the Inquisitor eventually gets 2d8+7d6+(Dex(2)) as a throughput option on their turn, but the Rogue's swinging 1d8+11d6+Dex. Assuming they don't go for d8s through the Burglar archetype, for which the Inquisitor has no equivalent.

And then comes the limited creature typing to further bring it below average overall output compared to a Rogue while still fulfilling much of the same class identity (big hits, skills, etc) -and- being the party healer. In those fights it behooves you to aim not at the dogs but at the huntsman for your hits to try and keep your pool high.

There's also the question of what's -on- the spell list. There -are- 5 damaging spells, but the majority of the spell list is either "Set up someone else with your action which slows down your damage and healing capabilities" or utility. So they'll mostly, but not entirely, be used out of combat.

As far as it not working with ranged attacks: Yeah. That's intentional. I wanted there to be situations where you can't easily use it in a given situation. As for why Stalvos has a pistol: It's more about the dramatic threat of training a pistol on someone as you recite their sins and heresies. Holding someone at the point of your rapier is plenty dramatic, but there's just something about putting a gun to someone's head that has a harsher vibe to it for visual imagery on your intimidation checks!

As far as the Slayer and Inquisitor both having a pile of skills: That's also intentional. I've always hated the "There's one person in the party with a bunch of skills and everyone else gets two or three" dynamic. I'm much more enamored of White Wolf's "Everyone gets a bunch of skills, but not all of them" structure so there's some overlap between concepts and for the most commonly used skills (Perception, Stealth, Etc)
 

Assuming they don't go for d8s through the Burglar archetype, for which the Inquisitor has no equivalent.
judicator's judgement from on high...?
As far as it not working with ranged attacks: Yeah. That's intentional. I wanted there to be situations where you can't easily use it in a given situation. As for why Stalvos has a pistol: It's more about the dramatic threat of training a pistol on someone as you recite their sins and heresies. Holding someone at the point of your rapier is plenty dramatic, but there's just something about putting a gun to someone's head that has a harsher vibe to it for visual imagery on your intimidation checks!
i figured it was an intentional balance decision, but i think giving a pistol to the iconic is a little...misleading? since it implies pistols are synergetic with the class when they're not.
As far as the Slayer and Inquisitor both having a pile of skills: That's also intentional. I've always hated the "There's one person in the party with a bunch of skills and everyone else gets two or three" dynamic. I'm much more enamored of White Wolf's "Everyone gets a bunch of skills, but not all of them" structure so there's some overlap between concepts and for the most commonly used skills (Perception, Stealth, Etc)
i do agree (and i'd go a step further and say that all martials should have more skills then all casters), but it is a noticeable separating point between regular classes and the quartet classes. might be worth it to have a sidebar that says "In a game with these classes and core classes, give the core classes one extra skill proficiency" or something
 

judicator's judgement from on high...?
... in my meager defense I wrote that months ago and forgot about it. Yup. It's there.

But the gap is still there!
i figured it was an intentional balance decision, but i think giving a pistol to the iconic is a little...misleading? since it implies pistols are synergetic with the class when they're not.
It's a thing, for sure, though it is still useful for the class, depending on the situation.
i do agree (and i'd go a step further and say that all martials should have more skills then all casters), but it is a noticeable separating point between regular classes and the quartet classes. might be worth it to have a sidebar that says "In a game with these classes and core classes, give the core classes one extra skill proficiency" or something
That -is- a good idea... Making the Martial Classes more skill-heavy than the caster classes, I mean. Allows for a lot more 'I do the thing' 'I just use magic' identity...

... I might make that a permanent structure going forward in my design philosophy...
 

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